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Managers Thread; Spain sack Lopetegui. Yes, really.
Topic Started: 21 May 2016, 09:07 PM (998,318 Views)
One sharp cookie
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Getting on a bit
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Joe the Baker
14 Oct 2017, 09:20 AM
One sharp cookie
14 Oct 2017, 09:18 AM
Plenty on here would have gladly taken Moyes at Celtic just 15 months ago. He made a horrendous blunder going to Sunderland but anyone who thinks he doesn't deserve to be a contender for the national job is at it. Three time manager of the year in England. He's had a miserable time of things recently but his CV remains infinitely more impressive than most of the names being mentioned.
Mention better names then.

Moyes is a non starter for me.
Not saying Moyes would be my first choice but maybe he just needs to find the right job to get his mojo back. He's taken on a couple of huge challenges and failed to deliver, but in his career overall he's had far more impressive seasons than poor ones. Shows how quick circumstances change for managers as, just a couple of years ago, Moyes would have been considered completely unattainable for the SFA. Now folk are turning their nose up at him and suggesting managerial nonentities like Tommy Wright and John Collins.
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Jack Thaler
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One sharp cookie
14 Oct 2017, 09:18 AM
Plenty on here would have gladly taken Moyes at Celtic just 15 months ago. He made a horrendous blunder going to Sunderland but anyone who thinks he doesn't deserve to be a contender for the national job is at it. Three time manager of the year in England. He's had a miserable time of things recently but his CV remains infinitely more impressive than most of the names being mentioned.
And plenty on here would have been hugely had Moyes been appointed.
He's a big dumpling whose best days are behind him.

Nothing in his career suggests he has the fire fighting skills needed to qualify a country for a major tournament.

Having a better CV than racist anti-Semite MacKay isn't saying much.
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Luigi
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Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
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Fly Pelican
The nascent 45
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Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
Has he taken any courses to remedy being a shampooe manager?
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danthestan
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Clarke confirmed at Killie
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Muzz
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BRFA
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danthestan
14 Oct 2017, 10:08 AM
Clarke confirmed at Killie
That's some appointment for Killie.
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idyllwild


Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
Yawn.

No-one is denying the reformed Malky X a livelihood. However, he shouldn't be the figurehead for the game in Scotland. I wouldn't trust him to give an appropriate message to children, never mind the whole football community.

The SFA once again have proven how utterly tone deaf they are.
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Bodom Bhoy
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Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
Yes, he's only ever been racist for 3 (whole conversations, not single) texts. He's never, ever said anything racist or held these views outside these.

I'm all for rehabilitation and applaud him if he has done so, but he's also proven himself to be a backwards thinking dickhead.
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Novelty_Bauble
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Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
Unwittingly?

Are you suggesting that Mackay wasn't aware how offensive those texts were when he sent them?
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stevie21
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Novelty_Bauble
14 Oct 2017, 10:36 AM
Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
Unwittingly?

Are you suggesting that Mackay wasn't aware how offensive those texts were when he sent them?
He said Malky's critics will have unwittingly done something shady, not Malky himself
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Jimmy_Quinn's_Hattrick
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Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
Uh-uh, no. This sob story about poor wee redeemed Malky is utter horseshampoo. Do you think he deserves credit for giving speeches, or saying "racism is bad, and I should know"? Of course he doesn't. "Don't be a racist woman-hater" is the bare minimum I would expect from a person. It isn't brave, or courageous, or exceptional to say these things are bad, because for people who aren't Malky Mackay it's actually the norm and requires no effort. You don't get points for reaching the same standard as any normal person, especially if you have to get sacked and publicly humiliated before coming to the realization that calling people "fkn chinkys", "a gay snake", "a Jew that sees money slipping through his fingers" and assessing someone's value by the whiteness of their face is not okay.

His actions were not "overstepping the mark", they were the actions of a racist, misogynist anti-semite who was used to getting away with it. He can't undo what he did, and no amount of speeches or special pleading will detoxify him. It is not at all appropriate for him to be a public representative of Scottish football in any capacity, nevermind the national team manager.
Edited by Jimmy_Quinn's_Hattrick, 14 Oct 2017, 11:02 AM.
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Novelty_Bauble
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stevie21
14 Oct 2017, 10:50 AM
Novelty_Bauble
14 Oct 2017, 10:36 AM
Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
Unwittingly?

Are you suggesting that Mackay wasn't aware how offensive those texts were when he sent them?
He said Malky's critics will have unwittingly done something shady, not Malky himself
So someone who may have caused offence, unintentionally, does not have the right to criticise someone who knew that they were being racist?
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Tubbytubthumper
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Jimmy_Quinn's_Hattrick
14 Oct 2017, 11:01 AM
Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
Uh-uh, no. This sob story about poor wee redeemed Malky is utter horseshampoo. Do you think he deserves credit for giving speeches, or saying "racism is bad, and I should know"? Of course he doesn't. "Don't be a racist woman-hater" is the bare minimum I would expect from a person. It isn't brave, or courageous, or exceptional to say these things are bad, because for people who aren't Malky Mackay it's actually the norm and requires no effort. You don't get points for reaching the same standard as any normal person, especially if you have to get sacked and publicly humiliated before coming to the realization that calling people "fkn chinkys", "a gay snake", "a Jew that sees money slipping through his fingers" and assessing someone's value by the whiteness of their face is not okay.

His actions were not "overstepping the mark", they were the actions of a racist, misogynist anti-semite who was used to getting away with it. He can't undo what he did, and no amount of speeches or special pleading will detoxify him. It is not at all appropriate for him to be a public representative of Scottish football in any capacity, nevermind the national team manager.
yep he need to be removed from any contact with other human beings.....

Listen, What MacKay said and did was wrong and I don't think anyone has said it is right - how could they.

However we are talking 3/4 years ago. Is it unreasonable to think that MacKay may have changed as a person? Realised that he was wrong, Realised that he had these faults. acknowledged that he needed to change his views. What he did was a symptom of ignorance, similar to all discriminatory actions and language. Is it unreasonable to think that he has challenged those ignorant views he had held.

The world has moved on, MacKay seems to have grown and moved on, surely we all need to move on from this too.
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stevie21
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Novelty_Bauble
14 Oct 2017, 11:15 AM
stevie21
14 Oct 2017, 10:50 AM
Novelty_Bauble
14 Oct 2017, 10:36 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
He said Malky's critics will have unwittingly done something shady, not Malky himself
So someone who may have caused offence, unintentionally, does not have the right to criticise someone who knew that they were being racist?
wtf are you on about? I've not expressed any opinion on the matter, just tried to clarify what appeared to be you misreading another post.
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Busa Bhoy
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Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
when i heard about the texts i never really read into it. i had a look back this morning and they are quite damning, theyre a lot worse than i thought they might be.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/cardiff-city/11047646/Malky-Mackay-texts-scandal-the-damning-evidence-discovered-by-Cardiff-chairman-Vincent-Tan.html
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Jimmy_Quinn's_Hattrick
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Tubbytubthumper
14 Oct 2017, 11:22 AM
Jimmy_Quinn's_Hattrick
14 Oct 2017, 11:01 AM
Luigi
14 Oct 2017, 10:04 AM
Malky McKay has taken numerous courses and has also undertaken a lot of speeches to school kids and others about racism and misogyny. He's faced up to the fact that what he wrote in 3 texts out of thousands was wrong. He's publicly spoken out about it yet some people would deny him his livelihood.
I know what he did is wrong and so does he. He's now an advocate for inclusion so he deserves a chance without all the moral crusaders having a go when it is very likely that those same people have likely overstepped the mark unwittingly as I know I have.
Uh-uh, no. This sob story about poor wee redeemed Malky is utter horseshampoo. Do you think he deserves credit for giving speeches, or saying "racism is bad, and I should know"? Of course he doesn't. "Don't be a racist woman-hater" is the bare minimum I would expect from a person. It isn't brave, or courageous, or exceptional to say these things are bad, because for people who aren't Malky Mackay it's actually the norm and requires no effort. You don't get points for reaching the same standard as any normal person, especially if you have to get sacked and publicly humiliated before coming to the realization that calling people "fkn chinkys", "a gay snake", "a Jew that sees money slipping through his fingers" and assessing someone's value by the whiteness of their face is not okay.

His actions were not "overstepping the mark", they were the actions of a racist, misogynist anti-semite who was used to getting away with it. He can't undo what he did, and no amount of speeches or special pleading will detoxify him. It is not at all appropriate for him to be a public representative of Scottish football in any capacity, nevermind the national team manager.
yep he need to be removed from any contact with other human beings.....

Listen, What MacKay said and did was wrong and I don't think anyone has said it is right - how could they.

However we are talking 3/4 years ago. Is it unreasonable to think that MacKay may have changed as a person? Realised that he was wrong, Realised that he had these faults. acknowledged that he needed to change his views. What he did was a symptom of ignorance, similar to all discriminatory actions and language. Is it unreasonable to think that he has challenged those ignorant views he had held.

The world has moved on, MacKay seems to have grown and moved on, surely we all need to move on from this too.
I'd thank you not to put words in my mouth.

Even if (and this is a big 'if') we assume that Mackay is genuinely remorseful, and not just sorry he got caught, he doesn't get special points for realizing what everyone else already knew without having to be shamed into it, nor does it undo the damage he did to his own reputation and the toxicity that is attached to him. That this will follow him for the rest of his career, such as it is, is his own damn fault. He is not the victim here: he knew what he was doing was wrong, and he did it anyway. There are consequences to that, and one consequence is that he's not an appropriate figure to represent Scottish football.
Edited by Jimmy_Quinn's_Hattrick, 14 Oct 2017, 11:45 AM.
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CELTBHOY1988
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That’s a good appointment for killie getting Clarke.
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tinsoldier
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McKay will take temporary charge of Scotland for one totally meaningless game. He won't be the new national team manager.

I still hope that the SFA look outside the normal press-produced "front runners" and surprise us with a Hiddink or even an Allardyce.

Moyes it is then.
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Novelty_Bauble
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stevie21
14 Oct 2017, 11:23 AM
Novelty_Bauble
14 Oct 2017, 11:15 AM
stevie21
14 Oct 2017, 10:50 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
So someone who may have caused offence, unintentionally, does not have the right to criticise someone who knew that they were being racist?
wtf are you on about? I've not expressed any opinion on the matter, just tried to clarify what appeared to be you misreading another post.
There is no need to get upset.

Question is for the original poster not you. Probably should have clarified that.
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blackwindmill
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I think David Moyes needs the Scotland job.
There's a good crop of players there to make the next tournament.
Two good years with Scotland and he might get a decent championship promotion chasing team after that.
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