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Brendan Rodgers; "I was born into Celtic"
Topic Started: 20 May 2016, 05:06 PM (2,287,905 Views)
puroresu_boy
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CHR15
23 Nov 2017, 04:59 PM
The amount of comments I've seen (not just on here, I mean in the wider media including from Brendan himself) defending the decision to go toe to toe with PSG instead of being a bit more circumspect is effing mental.

Either the boss knew we would get effing horsed again, accepted that, and thought it was STILL a good idea (or the best idea in his system) to do it, or he didn't think we'd end up getting skelped so badly. Either way that's two utterly ginormous defeats in the CL in two seasons. I'm not even including the asseffing they gave us at CP. Either way, an inability to look at something and think 'if I do that we'll get pumped by a record scoreline' and then not go and friggin do it anyways - no matter how good Brendan has been for Celtic, is concerning. Are we really to believe there's no honour, no justification, in trying to make yourselves difficult to beat from time to time? eff sake the Italians - much as I thnk they're the world's most boring team - have done it forever, and won stuff too.

I think Brendan is brilliant, and he's done a brililant job, but it cannot be the case that we rock up ad infinitum for these games shampooting ourselves that our crazy setup is going to see us effed sideways to the point we're praying to keep them to 'only' 7 goals. There isn't a team on the planet that should be able to do that to this Celtic team. 4 or 5 maybe, on a good day, but last night was a joke.
can you explain how that team was set up to go toe 2 toe?
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Gunner
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I agree with this philosophy of continuing to play our style, forcing our way of playing... especially against the best sides. Because against that absolute elite I dont see the point in changing our system.

BR could have went to a 6-3-1 / 7-3-0 / whatever ultra defensive system he wanted and that PSG team will still score goals.

So the options last night were, alter our shape and get beat maybe 3-0. Or continue with the philosphy and get battered. As sore as the latter was, there was probably more learning for BR And the players than changing the formation in the hope of a lesser drubbing. because lets be honest, if PSG are up for it, we could have an extra man and still struggle to get a draw.

--

I wouldnt be surprised if (when) we get into the Europe League and we are faced with Sides maybe a bit better than us, to see BR adopt a more defensive style with the hope of a draw. That would be a result. But last night, there was no point.
Edited by Gunner, 23 Nov 2017, 05:08 PM.
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InigoAtOttawa
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I'm largely relaxed about losing to PSG. And even by a bunch of goals. But I don't think Brendan gets a free pass for having Rogic on for 90 minutes in a game that required pressing, closing space and aggressive tackling. And McGregor isn't much better defensively. You set up the midfield like that and you're asking a bit much of Brown and Ntcham.
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hail_hail
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I understand why we done what we done. If we play our way against the better teams then when we play weaker teams we will be better off for it. The real proof will be in do we qualify for the Europa and how we fare there if we do.
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johncfc
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The true test is going to be against Anderlecht. I can accept playing a positive system against top opposition even when we get gubbed as long as the improvements BR talks about continues to develop. He proved it in the away game, now has to do it again at home with something to play for against an improved Anderlecht.

If we put up another's strong display, I'm all aboard BR's philosophy.
Edited by johncfc, 23 Nov 2017, 05:57 PM.
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CHR15
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puroresu_boy
23 Nov 2017, 05:03 PM
CHR15
23 Nov 2017, 04:59 PM
The amount of comments I've seen (not just on here, I mean in the wider media including from Brendan himself) defending the decision to go toe to toe with PSG instead of being a bit more circumspect is effing mental.

Either the boss knew we would get effing horsed again, accepted that, and thought it was STILL a good idea (or the best idea in his system) to do it, or he didn't think we'd end up getting skelped so badly. Either way that's two utterly ginormous defeats in the CL in two seasons. I'm not even including the asseffing they gave us at CP. Either way, an inability to look at something and think 'if I do that we'll get pumped by a record scoreline' and then not go and friggin do it anyways - no matter how good Brendan has been for Celtic, is concerning. Are we really to believe there's no honour, no justification, in trying to make yourselves difficult to beat from time to time? eff sake the Italians - much as I thnk they're the world's most boring team - have done it forever, and won stuff too.

I think Brendan is brilliant, and he's done a brililant job, but it cannot be the case that we rock up ad infinitum for these games shampooting ourselves that our crazy setup is going to see us effed sideways to the point we're praying to keep them to 'only' 7 goals. There isn't a team on the planet that should be able to do that to this Celtic team. 4 or 5 maybe, on a good day, but last night was a joke.
can you explain how that team was set up to go toe 2 toe?
Because that's how the team is set up every single time we play irrespective of opposition. What did you think they'd setup to do?
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Gonga
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Got to chat a wee bit to Franco Baldini again today.
He was saying that the confidence* of the top teams is much higher than it was even a few years ago, and the level has jumped in recent seasons. Said that Celtic shouldn’t feel embarrassed, it’s just a result of money changing the game.

There is definitely a psychological barrier we are fighting, not just financial.

*I didn’t mention Bawmans views on confidence.
Edited by Gonga, 23 Nov 2017, 06:21 PM.
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Midfield Maestro
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Gonga
23 Nov 2017, 06:18 PM
Got to chat a wee bit to Franco Baldini again today.
He was saying that the confidence* of the top teams is much higher than it was even a few years ago, and the level has jumped in recent seasons. Said that Celtic shouldn’t feel embarrassed, it’s just a result of money changing the game.

*I didn’t mention Bawmans views on confidence.
Absolutely agree on the point about confidence. We looked great until they scored and then the heads went down.

Paul Lambert made an interesting point about confidence after the game where he was saying he would never have had the confidence to play his normal game at that level as a Scottish player had he not gone to Germany.
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puroresu_boy
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CHR15
23 Nov 2017, 06:00 PM
puroresu_boy
23 Nov 2017, 05:03 PM
CHR15
23 Nov 2017, 04:59 PM
The amount of comments I've seen (not just on here, I mean in the wider media including from Brendan himself) defending the decision to go toe to toe with PSG instead of being a bit more circumspect is effing mental.

Either the boss knew we would get effing horsed again, accepted that, and thought it was STILL a good idea (or the best idea in his system) to do it, or he didn't think we'd end up getting skelped so badly. Either way that's two utterly ginormous defeats in the CL in two seasons. I'm not even including the asseffing they gave us at CP. Either way, an inability to look at something and think 'if I do that we'll get pumped by a record scoreline' and then not go and friggin do it anyways - no matter how good Brendan has been for Celtic, is concerning. Are we really to believe there's no honour, no justification, in trying to make yourselves difficult to beat from time to time? eff sake the Italians - much as I thnk they're the world's most boring team - have done it forever, and won stuff too.

I think Brendan is brilliant, and he's done a brililant job, but it cannot be the case that we rock up ad infinitum for these games shampooting ourselves that our crazy setup is going to see us effed sideways to the point we're praying to keep them to 'only' 7 goals. There isn't a team on the planet that should be able to do that to this Celtic team. 4 or 5 maybe, on a good day, but last night was a joke.
can you explain how that team was set up to go toe 2 toe?
Because that's how the team is set up every single time we play irrespective of opposition. What did you think they'd setup to do?
A balanced team where the aim was to try and break quickly which we did quite a few times.

To assume or guess we were sent out to go toe 2 toe based on how we play in other games is kinda lazy.
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jamiebhoy76
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Brendan is a genius. He knows PSG are being investigated by UEFA for FFP, where "The severest penalty is disqualification from the European competitions..".

He wanted that result to highlight the issue and knows we're going through to the last 16 once PSG get the boot.

Genius. Sheer Genius.
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stevie21
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Fortune Teller
23 Nov 2017, 04:50 PM
stevie21
23 Nov 2017, 04:48 PM
dannyclyro
23 Nov 2017, 01:38 PM

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Anderlecht need to beat us by 4 rather than 3 because we beat them 3-0, and it's our head to head against them that counts. What the score was between us and PSG has no bearing on whether Anderlecht overtake us or not. Anderlecht will finish ahead of us if they end up on more points than us (not possible) or finish level on points & have a better head to head against us (possible). Nothing to do with goal difference overall.
If they beat us 3-0 the head to head is equal and goes to goal difference, which they will go through with as they will be 3 goals better off than we will.

They wont win 3-0 though so it doesn't matter
Good point :thumbsup:
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jbj712
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Some amount of tosh being talked on here to try and defend the indefensible. Brendan has done many good things since he arrived but there is no way round the fact that he is on the verge of turning us in to a joke in the CL.
Last season against Barca was poor but he could argue that he was only in the door. There is no such excuse now. He knows his players, their strengths and weaknesses. A coach or manager has a duty to the supporters and players to pick the best players and formation that will get as good a result as they can. No one is saying that we should “park the bus” but we are entitled to see a team work harder to deny our opponents cheap goals.
Footballing philosophies are great if you can afford them! We self evidently cannot afford the type of players that Brendan needs to implement his ideas. There was no aggressive defending last night, no great high pressing for 9 minutes let alone 90
Even Ronnie won the league in Scotland, any decent competent manager would. Most would also give us a fighting chance of CL qualification.
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puroresu_boy
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jbj712
23 Nov 2017, 06:59 PM
Some amount of tosh being talked on here to try and defend the indefensible. Brendan has done many good things since he arrived but there is no way round the fact that he is on the verge of turning us in to a joke in the CL.
Last season against Barca was poor but he could argue that he was only in the door. There is no such excuse now. He knows his players, their strengths and weaknesses. A coach or manager has a duty to the supporters and players to pick the best players and formation that will get as good a result as they can. No one is saying that we should “park the bus” but we are entitled to see a team work harder to deny our opponents cheap goals.
Footballing philosophies are great if you can afford them! We self evidently cannot afford the type of players that Brendan needs to implement his ideas. There was no aggressive defending last night, no great high pressing for 9 minutes let alone 90
Even Ronnie won the league in Scotland, any decent competent manager would. Most would also give us a fighting chance of CL qualification.
Any half decent player will look great in scotland........ See where this is going.
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Kingslim
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puroresu_boy
23 Nov 2017, 06:48 PM
CHR15
23 Nov 2017, 06:00 PM
puroresu_boy
23 Nov 2017, 05:03 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Because that's how the team is set up every single time we play irrespective of opposition. What did you think they'd setup to do?
A balanced team where the aim was to try and break quickly which we did quite a few times.

To assume or guess we were sent out to go toe 2 toe based on how we play in other games is kinda lazy.
We committed plenty players forward.

Our defensive line was a shambles in the second half. We were sitting halfway between the goal line and half way line which allowed them to ping balls in behind at will.

Some of our attacking play was very good last night and very pleasing to see, but I still don’t think a few passages of good play justifies leaving ourselves open to the likes of thumpings we’ve been getting
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mick82
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Kingslim
23 Nov 2017, 07:11 PM
puroresu_boy
23 Nov 2017, 06:48 PM
CHR15
23 Nov 2017, 06:00 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
A balanced team where the aim was to try and break quickly which we did quite a few times.

To assume or guess we were sent out to go toe 2 toe based on how we play in other games is kinda lazy.
We committed plenty players forward.

Our defensive line was a shambles in the second half. We were sitting halfway between the goal line and half way line which allowed them to ping balls in behind at will.

Some of our attacking play was very good last night and very pleasing to see, but I still don’t think a few passages of good play justifies leaving ourselves open to the likes of thumpings we’ve been getting
We were seldom anywhere near the middle of our own half in the second half.

We were not undone by being too attacking. We lined up 5-4-1. We had plenty of players back. They just couldn't handle PSG
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Maleys Spirit
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Defensive side of our game is based on team pressing not tough tackling aggressive defensive minded players which you barely have any of in the squad.

We binned the press after they dismantled it Brazilian style in the first game, he spoke pre match about how comfortable their keeper and defence were at retaining and recycling the ball and knew a high pressing game wasn`t going to work.

He`s being dealt backhanded compliments by saying he beats what he`s supposed to. He came pretty close to beating City and gave a good account against both German teams in different matches but came up short IMO due to real genuine quality in the keeper,defensive mid and CB area. City and the German teams have massive resources compared to ours so there isn`t a massive fix required. What we do need is some wiser spending which still won`t help us lay a glove on these doped up monsters but should help us get closer to the others.

The only way I can think of to protect that (yet again part makeshift) defence more was to pack the midfield last night and of the players who didn`t start only Eboue and Bitton have any defensive quality, they both finished the game so it`a tough ask with what he`s got. Having three out of your four preferred attacking/creative types injured or off form doesn`t help your outball either, Roberts, Sinclair and Rogic at their best are dangerous.

He`s a bloody good manager but he is not a miracle worker.

As for PSG , hate the sight of them but Rabiot is my dream midfielder.
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Kingslim
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mick82
23 Nov 2017, 08:12 PM
Kingslim
23 Nov 2017, 07:11 PM
puroresu_boy
23 Nov 2017, 06:48 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
We committed plenty players forward.

Our defensive line was a shambles in the second half. We were sitting halfway between the goal line and half way line which allowed them to ping balls in behind at will.

Some of our attacking play was very good last night and very pleasing to see, but I still don’t think a few passages of good play justifies leaving ourselves open to the likes of thumpings we’ve been getting
We were seldom anywhere near the middle of our own half in the second half.

We were not undone by being too attacking. We lined up 5-4-1. We had plenty of players back. They just couldn't handle PSG
I must have imagined all those chipped balls in behind our back line then.

5-4-1 or not - we committed plenty of bodies forward. We had two players in their box straight from kick off. It wasn’t a defensive line up when you have Forrest, McGregor and Rogic in there.


Who was the other centre half? Lustig? Forrest at RB? Didn’t look that way. Looked more 4-4-1-1. I heard Brendan say he played 5.


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mick82
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Lustig Boyata and Simunovic at centreback. Forrest and Tierney as wing backs. Brown and Ntcham centre mid, Rogic to the right and McGregor to the left.

We pressed well early on but dropped deeper and deeper as game went on. Centrebacks were practically starting on the bye line when Gordon had kick outs.

I genuinely can't think of one occasion our back line were caught out too far up the park.
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LondonThomas
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Our defensive organisation and personnel needs completely overhauled.

Losing seven goals should never be acceptable, even against the financially-doped clubs.
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subtle_anxiety
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jbj712
23 Nov 2017, 06:59 PM
Some amount of tosh being talked on here to try and defend the indefensible. Brendan has done many good things since he arrived but there is no way round the fact that he is on the verge of turning us in to a joke in the CL.
Last season against Barca was poor but he could argue that he was only in the door. There is no such excuse now. He knows his players, their strengths and weaknesses. A coach or manager has a duty to the supporters and players to pick the best players and formation that will get as good a result as they can. No one is saying that we should “park the bus” but we are entitled to see a team work harder to deny our opponents cheap goals.
Footballing philosophies are great if you can afford them! We self evidently cannot afford the type of players that Brendan needs to implement his ideas. There was no aggressive defending last night, no great high pressing for 9 minutes let alone 90
Even Ronnie won the league in Scotland, any decent competent manager would. Most would also give us a fighting chance of CL qualification.
No patience. Takes more than 14 months to change the viewpoint of a generation of a whole nation on how to approach these games. When was the last time we went to a place like Anderlecht and spanked them 3 going on 6 ? Rodgers knows what he is doing and won't listen to panic merchants screaming for 11 behind the ball at the slightest hint of a problem. Fair enough to blow off steam on a internet thread but get a grip. If you can't see the bigger picture that Rodgers is going for then you are in for many an anxious moment in his reign
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