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Brendan Rodgers; "I was born into Celtic"
Topic Started: 20 May 2016, 05:06 PM (2,288,246 Views)
stevie21
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allthewine
19 Sep 2016, 03:55 PM
stevie21
19 Sep 2016, 03:35 PM
allthewine
19 Sep 2016, 02:41 PM

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Nah, but the first is definitely on him. If it had gone over him completely then fair play but he got a full hand on it, to no effect. Same poor technique from DDV as Neymar's free kick. Gordon would've saved both.
I am not disagreeing. I just think to say he cost us 2 points is wrong. We were 2-1 up.
Save that though and we're 2 nil up with minutes to go. ICT don't have a draw to chase and we get three points
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kellybhoy
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adammce
19 Sep 2016, 04:16 PM
Milton
19 Sep 2016, 04:05 PM
2 clean sheets (1 of which was at home to part-timers) in 13 games is pretty pathetic in all honesty.

We desperately needed to address this in the transfer window and failed. I can't see us picking up a single point as it stands in the Champions League. Just need to hope we can improve in January and go into things next year with a more balanced squad to make sure we bank the money again. Qualification next year and strengthening our coefficient is arguably more important than recent years given the changes coming up. The board really need to come up with the goods.

Overall though, happy with our entertaining style of play and enjoying having a proper manager in charge. It'd be slightly unreasonable to expect wholesale change from the shambles Ronny left behind so quickly, so all things considered we're doing well. I don't think we're too far away from having a side capable of competing in Europe again.
Not to piss on the chips, but Rodgers spent massively on defenders in the past and still had the same (pish) defensive record season in, season out. We could spend our whole budget on defenders and I reckon we'd still look like we were defending on an ice rink.

Every manager has a weakness. I'd say his blind spot for defending is probably his biggest flaw, and does not look to have improved on that too much. Every team has it's flaws, looks like ours is going to be a comedy defence.
Then he should have a top defensive coach sitting beside him. Doesn't seem like Kennedy is filling that role. Not effectively anyway.
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Milton
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adammce
19 Sep 2016, 04:16 PM
Milton
19 Sep 2016, 04:05 PM
2 clean sheets (1 of which was at home to part-timers) in 13 games is pretty pathetic in all honesty.

We desperately needed to address this in the transfer window and failed. I can't see us picking up a single point as it stands in the Champions League. Just need to hope we can improve in January and go into things next year with a more balanced squad to make sure we bank the money again. Qualification next year and strengthening our coefficient is arguably more important than recent years given the changes coming up. The board really need to come up with the goods.

Overall though, happy with our entertaining style of play and enjoying having a proper manager in charge. It'd be slightly unreasonable to expect wholesale change from the shambles Ronny left behind so quickly, so all things considered we're doing well. I don't think we're too far away from having a side capable of competing in Europe again.
Not to piss on the chips, but Rodgers spent massively on defenders in the past and still had the same (pish) defensive record season in, season out. We could spend our whole budget on defenders and I reckon we'd still look like we were defending on an ice rink.

Every manager has a weakness. I'd say his blind spot for defending is probably his biggest flaw, and does not look to have improved on that too much. Every team has it's flaws, looks like ours is going to be a comedy defence.
The key to being competitive in Europe at our level is prioritising solid defensive tactics and personnel over attacking prowess. Gordon Strachan and Neil Lennon sides were a good example of this.

To be fair to Brendan, I believe the Gamboa signing was made specifically to give us a counter attacking threat. He needs to replace Bitton (and possibly Brown too) with a central midfielder capable of tracking the opposition better. You only need to look at the successful midfield pairings during our biggest wins in the last 10 years to see where we're lacking the most. The Bitton/Brown double act has started it's Champions League legacy with a 6-1 and 7-0 hammering against Barcelona.

He's still a young guy in managerial terms. I'm sure he actually will learn from it, like he says. Keeping the faith.
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adammce
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kellybhoy
19 Sep 2016, 04:44 PM
adammce
19 Sep 2016, 04:16 PM
Milton
19 Sep 2016, 04:05 PM
2 clean sheets (1 of which was at home to part-timers) in 13 games is pretty pathetic in all honesty.

We desperately needed to address this in the transfer window and failed. I can't see us picking up a single point as it stands in the Champions League. Just need to hope we can improve in January and go into things next year with a more balanced squad to make sure we bank the money again. Qualification next year and strengthening our coefficient is arguably more important than recent years given the changes coming up. The board really need to come up with the goods.

Overall though, happy with our entertaining style of play and enjoying having a proper manager in charge. It'd be slightly unreasonable to expect wholesale change from the shambles Ronny left behind so quickly, so all things considered we're doing well. I don't think we're too far away from having a side capable of competing in Europe again.
Not to piss on the chips, but Rodgers spent massively on defenders in the past and still had the same (pish) defensive record season in, season out. We could spend our whole budget on defenders and I reckon we'd still look like we were defending on an ice rink.

Every manager has a weakness. I'd say his blind spot for defending is probably his biggest flaw, and does not look to have improved on that too much. Every team has it's flaws, looks like ours is going to be a comedy defence.
Then he should have a top defensive coach sitting beside him. Doesn't seem like Kennedy is filling that role. Not effectively anyway.
:lol: the mythical defensive coach. Not sure it even works that way mate. I know a few coaches and none of them describe themselves in such terms. They might have an attacking or defensive philosophy but they work with the whole team.

Bringing in someone with a defensive philosophy, even, contradicts what we work on elsewhere in our play. From what I've learned, you don't break the team down into three slots and work with a certain coach like it's a school lesson. The team has to be taught to defend as a unit, in both attacking and defense as well as handle transitions. Rodgers has always struggled with managing transitioning from attack to defence and he may always will. However we could go hire Maldini to be our defensive coach, if it's not compatible with every other element of our play it'll never work. You need coaches that work the whole team, not splitting it into segments like that.

Agreed regarding the team Milton. He has his flaws but at the same time you can't build a whole new squad in one summer. If we're still talking about being shampoo in transition and being easy to score against in 2018, I'll worry then. It's a very hard thing to solve and especially with our budget and player turnover ratio it could take even longer.
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Mubo Loravcik
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adammce
19 Sep 2016, 06:08 PM
kellybhoy
19 Sep 2016, 04:44 PM
adammce
19 Sep 2016, 04:16 PM

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Then he should have a top defensive coach sitting beside him. Doesn't seem like Kennedy is filling that role. Not effectively anyway.
:lol: the mythical defensive coach. Not sure it even works that way mate. I know a few coaches and none of them describe themselves in such terms. They might have an attacking or defensive philosophy but they work with the whole team.

Bringing in someone with a defensive philosophy, even, contradicts what we work on elsewhere in our play. From what I've learned, you don't break the team down into three slots and work with a certain coach like it's a school lesson. The team has to be taught to defend as a unit, in both attacking and defense as well as handle transitions. Rodgers has always struggled with managing transitioning from attack to defence and he may always will. However we could go hire Maldini to be our defensive coach, if it's not compatible with every other element of our play it'll never work. You need coaches that work the whole team, not splitting it into segments like that.

Agreed regarding the team Milton. He has his flaws but at the same time you can't build a whole new squad in one summer. If we're still talking about being shampoo in transition and being easy to score against in 2018, I'll worry then. It's a very hard thing to solve and especially with our budget and player turnover ratio it could take even longer.
I partly concur.
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adammce
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Mubo Loravcik
19 Sep 2016, 06:09 PM
adammce
19 Sep 2016, 06:08 PM
kellybhoy
19 Sep 2016, 04:44 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
:lol: the mythical defensive coach. Not sure it even works that way mate. I know a few coaches and none of them describe themselves in such terms. They might have an attacking or defensive philosophy but they work with the whole team.

Bringing in someone with a defensive philosophy, even, contradicts what we work on elsewhere in our play. From what I've learned, you don't break the team down into three slots and work with a certain coach like it's a school lesson. The team has to be taught to defend as a unit, in both attacking and defense as well as handle transitions. Rodgers has always struggled with managing transitioning from attack to defence and he may always will. However we could go hire Maldini to be our defensive coach, if it's not compatible with every other element of our play it'll never work. You need coaches that work the whole team, not splitting it into segments like that.

Agreed regarding the team Milton. He has his flaws but at the same time you can't build a whole new squad in one summer. If we're still talking about being shampoo in transition and being easy to score against in 2018, I'll worry then. It's a very hard thing to solve and especially with our budget and player turnover ratio it could take even longer.
I partly concur.
Care to elaborate, friend?

Probably the 2018 bit eh? :lol: my stance on that is that we have a manager who'll never make it his sole priority. Therefore even the defensive players we buy will be attack minded I would imagine. Given this it will take a long time to build a cohesive system. Knowing us, we'd manage that for about six months before Pedro and the boys jettison off one our key cogs. Then we have to start again. As such I wouldn't be shocked if we were inconsistent and quite mediocre defensively in Europe. If we had the will/money to keep players for longer then I would expect it would be a faster process.

I also would expect us to improve in the league as we get to grips with the attacking style more. The better we get, the less we should get caught out in the league in transition. We'll see but would be shocked and impressed if he could get us consistently defending with patience whilst also attacking excitingly.
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allthewine
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adammce
19 Sep 2016, 06:57 PM
Mubo Loravcik
19 Sep 2016, 06:09 PM
adammce
19 Sep 2016, 06:08 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I partly concur.
Care to elaborate, friend?

Probably the 2018 bit eh? :lol: my stance on that is that we have a manager who'll never make it his sole priority. Therefore even the defensive players we buy will be attack minded I would imagine. Given this it will take a long time to build a cohesive system. Knowing us, we'd manage that for about six months before Pedro and the boys jettison off one our key cogs. Then we have to start again. As such I wouldn't be shocked if we were inconsistent and quite mediocre defensively in Europe. If we had the will/money to keep players for longer then I would expect it would be a faster process.

I also would expect us to improve in the league as we get to grips with the attacking style more. The better we get, the less we should get caught out in the league in transition. We'll see but would be shocked and impressed if he could get us consistently defending with patience whilst also attacking excitingly.
I don't think it is such a bad trait to have tbh, mate. Especially at SPFL level. We will create so many chances that no one will be able to live with us.

In Europe we will have to be a little smarter.
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SaMule
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I don't know about having a dedicated defensive coach per se, but there are surely coaches who are better at teaching players about defensive positioning etc than others so maybe that's something that we do need to think about. If nothing else, a coach who can help us organise ourselves at set plays (at both ends of the pitch) would be handy.

All that said, I still maintain that signing a Wanyama or Lennon type in midfield would be the quickest way to shore up the defence.
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Swiss Guard
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Here come the Kerrydale coaching experts to advise Brendan how to do his job. I'm sure he's reading and taking notes in his wee jotter.

Honeymoon period over.
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Dannybhoy95
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Swiss Guard
19 Sep 2016, 08:30 PM
Here come the Kerrydale coaching experts to advise Brendan how to do his job. I'm sure he's reading and taking notes in his wee jotter.

Honeymoon period over.
It's hardly a huge secret that his defensive organisation is highly questionable. It's partly the reason I'd have taken Moyes at the time. Don't get me wrong, I'm delighted we've got Rodgers, and going forward we're several levels above anything else in Scotland. However there's a gaping hole that seems to be part of all Rodgers teams.

His best season defensively was the season he got Swansea promoted. 42 goals conceded in 46 games. His worst being 51 in 38, granted that's his first PL season, but.

We look more or less on course for the usual +1 goal-a-game average, which is a concern as we simply won't be putting 2 and 3 past teams every week. I thought being Celtic and the fact there's only a select handful of teams that actually try to attack us, we'd naturally see more clean sheets than his in his England stint. That doesn't look like the case, sadly.
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Dannybhoy95
20 Sep 2016, 12:17 PM
Swiss Guard
19 Sep 2016, 08:30 PM
Here come the Kerrydale coaching experts to advise Brendan how to do his job. I'm sure he's reading and taking notes in his wee jotter.

Honeymoon period over.
It's hardly a huge secret that his defensive organisation is highly questionable. It's partly the reason I'd have taken Moyes at the time. Don't get me wrong, I'm delighted we've got Rodgers, and going forward we're several levels above anything else in Scotland. However there's a gaping hole that seems to be part of all Rodgers teams.

His best season defensively was the season he got Swansea promoted. 42 goals conceded in 46 games. His worst being 51 in 38, granted that's his first PL season, but.

We look more or less on course for the usual +1 goal-a-game average, which is a concern as we simply won't be putting 2 and 3 past teams every week. I thought being Celtic and the fact there's only a select handful of teams that actually try to attack us, we'd naturally see more clean sheets than his in his England stint. That doesn't look like the case, sadly.
Have we not put 2 or 3 past every team we have played so far? I cant see whats going to stop that from happening.
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remy mcswain
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Gazebo of Dignity
20 Sep 2016, 12:22 PM
Dannybhoy95
20 Sep 2016, 12:17 PM
Swiss Guard
19 Sep 2016, 08:30 PM
Here come the Kerrydale coaching experts to advise Brendan how to do his job. I'm sure he's reading and taking notes in his wee jotter.

Honeymoon period over.
It's hardly a huge secret that his defensive organisation is highly questionable. It's partly the reason I'd have taken Moyes at the time. Don't get me wrong, I'm delighted we've got Rodgers, and going forward we're several levels above anything else in Scotland. However there's a gaping hole that seems to be part of all Rodgers teams.

His best season defensively was the season he got Swansea promoted. 42 goals conceded in 46 games. His worst being 51 in 38, granted that's his first PL season, but.

We look more or less on course for the usual +1 goal-a-game average, which is a concern as we simply won't be putting 2 and 3 past teams every week. I thought being Celtic and the fact there's only a select handful of teams that actually try to attack us, we'd naturally see more clean sheets than his in his England stint. That doesn't look like the case, sadly.
Have we not put 2 or 3 past every team we have played so far? I cant see whats going to stop that from happening.
We failed to score against Red Imps, Hapoel and Barcelona Away. Lost all 3.

We scored 1 v Astana away. Draw.

If we want to get any points in the CL, we have to improve defensively.
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Flawless
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We should have went for Moyes. We'd still let in goals and be boring as shampoo.

Give the guy some effing time holy mother of eff. We're what 5 clear with a game in hand, he dragged this sorry bunch of arseholes into the CL after getting about 7 weeks with them, cuffed the top four in our league including stuffing the huns 5-1.

It's the 20th of September. He's had one window in which he had to sort out the calamity we were in. I'm sure he'll have plans for the defence but he's rightly identified that in Scotland it's less of a priority than how good you are going forward. Something he's certainly address quickly and well.

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Dannybhoy95
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Gazebo of Dignity
20 Sep 2016, 12:22 PM
Have we not put 2 or 3 past every team we have played so far? I cant see whats going to stop that from happening.
Domestically, aye.

However, you just don't go a full season pumping teams. That's just not how Football works. There's games that you need to grind out 1-0 results, even Barca and Bayern have to do it on occasion.

For obvious reasons, I'll happily give him a pass in Europe this season, though.
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Flawless
20 Sep 2016, 12:30 PM
We should have went for Moyes. We'd still let in goals and be boring as shampoo.

Give the guy some effing time holy mother of eff. We're what 5 clear with a game in hand, he dragged this sorry bunch of arseholes into the CL after getting about 7 weeks with them, cuffed the top four in our league including stuffing the huns 5-1.

It's the 20th of September. He's had one window in which he had to sort out the calamity we were in. I'm sure he'll have plans for the defence but he's rightly identified that in Scotland it's less of a priority than how good you are going forward. Something he's certainly address quickly and well.

:thumbsup:

People are absolutely desperate to moan at something, it's mental. Not even saying that the defence isn't an issue or that we'll need to be better in Europe but we're probably still 2 or 3 signings away from being the team he wants us to be. This is just the beginning.
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stevie21
19 Sep 2016, 04:24 PM
allthewine
19 Sep 2016, 03:55 PM
stevie21
19 Sep 2016, 03:35 PM

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I am not disagreeing. I just think to say he cost us 2 points is wrong. We were 2-1 up.
Save that though and we're 2 nil up with minutes to go. ICT don't have a draw to chase and we get three points
That's not strictly true.
He saves King's shot, and it's a different game.
We only lead 1-0, though.
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Jack Thaler
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Flawless
20 Sep 2016, 12:30 PM
We should have went for Moyes. We'd still let in goals and be boring as shampoo.

Give the guy some effing time holy mother of eff. We're what 5 clear with a game in hand, he dragged this sorry bunch of arseholes into the CL after getting about 7 weeks with them, cuffed the top four in our league including stuffing the huns 5-1.

It's the 20th of September. He's had one window in which he had to sort out the calamity we were in. I'm sure he'll have plans for the defence but he's rightly identified that in Scotland it's less of a priority than how good you are going forward. Something he's certainly address quickly and well.

:thumbsup:
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Flawless
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Cumbernauldbhoy
20 Sep 2016, 12:33 PM
Flawless
20 Sep 2016, 12:30 PM
We should have went for Moyes. We'd still let in goals and be boring as shampoo.

Give the guy some effing time holy mother of eff. We're what 5 clear with a game in hand, he dragged this sorry bunch of arseholes into the CL after getting about 7 weeks with them, cuffed the top four in our league including stuffing the huns 5-1.

It's the 20th of September. He's had one window in which he had to sort out the calamity we were in. I'm sure he'll have plans for the defence but he's rightly identified that in Scotland it's less of a priority than how good you are going forward. Something he's certainly address quickly and well.

:thumbsup:

People are absolutely desperate to moan at something, it's mental. Not even saying that the defence isn't an issue or that we'll need to be better in Europe but we're probably still 2 or 3 signings away from being the team he wants us to be. This is just the beginning.
Correct.

I'd be stunned if he doesn't spend a lot more time and money in the next 2/3 windows on the midfield and defence. He's identified the main weakness for Scottish games which was we lacked pace and options.

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Dannybhoy95
20 Sep 2016, 12:32 PM
Gazebo of Dignity
20 Sep 2016, 12:22 PM
Have we not put 2 or 3 past every team we have played so far? I cant see whats going to stop that from happening.
Domestically, aye.

However, you just don't go a full season pumping teams. That's just not how Football works. There's games that you need to grind out 1-0 results, even Barca and Bayern have to do it on occasion.

For obvious reasons, I'll happily give him a pass in Europe this season, though.
Might be a valid point if we hadn't played 5/38 games this season of course.

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Jack Thaler
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Dannybhoy95
20 Sep 2016, 12:17 PM
Swiss Guard
19 Sep 2016, 08:30 PM
Here come the Kerrydale coaching experts to advise Brendan how to do his job. I'm sure he's reading and taking notes in his wee jotter.

Honeymoon period over.
It's hardly a huge secret that his defensive organisation is highly questionable. It's partly the reason I'd have taken Moyes at the time. Don't get me wrong, I'm delighted we've got Rodgers, and going forward we're several levels above anything else in Scotland. However there's a gaping hole that seems to be part of all Rodgers teams.

His best season defensively was the season he got Swansea promoted. 42 goals conceded in 46 games. His worst being 51 in 38, granted that's his first PL season, but.

We look more or less on course for the usual +1 goal-a-game average, which is a concern as we simply won't be putting 2 and 3 past teams every week. I thought being Celtic and the fact there's only a select handful of teams that actually try to attack us, we'd naturally see more clean sheets than his in his England stint. That doesn't look like the case, sadly.
Our gaping hole is midfield, where we lack quality.
I'm sure that will be addressed in the next window, as will the goalkeeping situation.
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