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Brendan Rodgers; "I was born into Celtic"
Topic Started: 20 May 2016, 05:06 PM (2,288,254 Views)
fatboab
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Just before the Dawn

Brendan made a couple of questionable calls last night, notably changing the shape to a back 5 , and including a debutant in Gamboa . Also, as others have pointed out, only having 2 recognised midfielders allowed Barca to play so high up the pitch, we had no space to get out at times.
He didn't have huge options, to be fair, and the last day of the window's failure to secure a strong midfielder added to our woes.
How he deals with adversity will tell us more about him than any amount of domestic successes though. I hope when Man City come calling that we have learned something about how we have to play in these games. Time will tell.
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M1K3Y89
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Would rather he made the mistakes in Camp Nou than anywhere else to be honest.
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esme stuart
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14 Sep 2016, 10:34 AM
esme stuart
14 Sep 2016, 09:59 AM
Novelty_Bauble
14 Sep 2016, 08:52 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
The 5 at the back scenario is a result of not having 4 reasonable midfield options that would enable you to set up 2 banks of 4 in an effort to combat a team like Barca i.e. Celtic needed 4 midfield players willing and able to exhibit a defensive mentality when required.

However we don't, despite the plethora of midfielders stockpiled over the years, have players capable of this. The teams we play in the SPFL dictated we could do without such players but the rigours of European competition suggests we need them now.

As with the Imps setback, Brendan now has the evidence to present to the powers that be that quality players are required in the engine room of the team. This requirement was allowed to pass during the last window. It had better not come January.
----Bitton

Forrest-Brown-Armstrong-Sinclair

There's 5 MF's for you and Rogic and Roberts on the bench. We had 6 MF's available that are in good to very good form.
Ryan Christie, Kris Commons, Scott Allen, GMS,..there's another 4 for you, all with admirable set skills that unfortunately don't include defensive capabilities. Another post pointed out the 0-1 reverse recently had Ledley and Wanyama in there who were able to offer protection to a defence that included Efe.

My point is, of the 12 or so mids on our books, only Brown and Bitton are recognised as POTENTIALLY having defensive qualities...and frankly my heart sinks when these 2 are paired together.

We need to revamp the midfield in January so that some are replaced with guys that realise part of the remit of that area of the team is to offer protection to the defence.
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tinytim81
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Midfield Maestro
14 Sep 2016, 09:28 AM
He got it wrong last night by not putting more bodies in the midfield, but he's just in the door and the squad still needs some rebuilding.

I think I'm right in saying that by this stage in each of O'Neill's, Strachan's and Lennon's first seasons we were already out of Europe altogether. And obviously no other Celtic manager has qualified for the Champions League group stages in his first season. So, he's ahead of schedule and I think this season should be viewed as a learning experience for Brendan and for those players he will build his Celtic team around.

Managing Celtic in Europe is a learning curve. Eking our results in Europe with a squad which costs £15 million against squads which cost ten or twenty times that (and more) is something Strachan and Lennon had to learn to do. And they did learn to do it, for the most part. The financial disparity is growing - and it has certainly grown massively since O'Neill's time - which is all the more reason why qualifying this year was so important.

I actually don't think we're a million miles away from being a team which could compete at this level and potentially qualify for the last 16 (if we don't get a horror show of a draw like this year). We need a better defensive shape - that will come. And we need a Boruc/Forster and a Wanyama.
I agree although I'm not sure if we'll ever manage to get into the knockout stages again unless we improve dramatically and get a half decent draw.

It's amazing to think in the last twelve years we have drawn Barcelona in Europe seven or eight times and within that period (from Guardiola through to the present day) they have basically become the greatest football team of all time.

Brutal that we're always up against them.
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Govan Super Casino
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esme stuart
14 Sep 2016, 11:34 AM
Govan Super Casino
14 Sep 2016, 10:34 AM
esme stuart
14 Sep 2016, 09:59 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
----Bitton

Forrest-Brown-Armstrong-Sinclair

There's 5 MF's for you and Rogic and Roberts on the bench. We had 6 MF's available that are in good to very good form.
Ryan Christie, Kris Commons, Scott Allen, GMS,..there's another 4 for you, all with admirable set skills that unfortunately don't include defensive capabilities. Another post pointed out the 0-1 reverse recently had Ledley and Wanyama in there who were able to offer protection to a defence that included Efe.

My point is, of the 12 or so mids on our books, only Brown and Bitton are recognised as POTENTIALLY having defensive qualities...and frankly my heart sinks when these 2 are paired together.

We need to revamp the midfield in January so that some are replaced with guys that realise part of the remit of that area of the team is to offer protection to the defence.
We do need a revamp but that's a completely different point and one we can do nothing about right now.

Ledley was the best goal scoring MF we've had in years and bar the Juve game Efe was excellent that CL campaign. Brown and Bitton were superb defensively in 14/15, Armstrong, Forrest and Sinclair are capable of tracking back and winning the ball. Playing an extra defender doesn't necessarily make you stronger in defence.

We had options and the manager chose the wrong one. There's a reason teams don't play back 5's against Barca.
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OzzyBhoy
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tonyjaa-csc
14 Sep 2016, 07:36 AM
According to the BBC gossip page he's interested in
Barnsley centre midfield captain Conor Hourihane.............as are Villa & Sevco :lolhuns:
I'd be stunned if we signed Hourihane. Quality player.
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ronny_is_not_da_man
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He knows what he needs. This will just re-affirm that. If it isn't sorted for the next qualifiers then questions need to be asked why.
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Midfield Maestro
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tinytim81
14 Sep 2016, 11:49 AM
Midfield Maestro
14 Sep 2016, 09:28 AM
He got it wrong last night by not putting more bodies in the midfield, but he's just in the door and the squad still needs some rebuilding.

I think I'm right in saying that by this stage in each of O'Neill's, Strachan's and Lennon's first seasons we were already out of Europe altogether. And obviously no other Celtic manager has qualified for the Champions League group stages in his first season. So, he's ahead of schedule and I think this season should be viewed as a learning experience for Brendan and for those players he will build his Celtic team around.

Managing Celtic in Europe is a learning curve. Eking our results in Europe with a squad which costs £15 million against squads which cost ten or twenty times that (and more) is something Strachan and Lennon had to learn to do. And they did learn to do it, for the most part. The financial disparity is growing - and it has certainly grown massively since O'Neill's time - which is all the more reason why qualifying this year was so important.

I actually don't think we're a million miles away from being a team which could compete at this level and potentially qualify for the last 16 (if we don't get a horror show of a draw like this year). We need a better defensive shape - that will come. And we need a Boruc/Forster and a Wanyama.
I agree although I'm not sure if we'll ever manage to get into the knockout stages again unless we improve dramatically and get a half decent draw.

It's amazing to think in the last twelve years we have drawn Barcelona in Europe seven or eight times and within that period (from Guardiola through to the present day) they have basically become the greatest football team of all time.

Brutal that we're always up against them.
We've got through to the last 16 with a team including Caldwell, McManus, Naylor, Telfer, Hartley and Robson. We can do it again.

It will take lots of improvement (particularly when it comes to our defensive shape), a few quality additions to the squad and a lot more nous, which will come by playing at this level. It is beyond us this year but it is not beyond us in structural terms (yet).
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Midfield Maestro
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OzzyBhoy
14 Sep 2016, 11:53 AM
tonyjaa-csc
14 Sep 2016, 07:36 AM
According to the BBC gossip page he's interested in
Barnsley centre midfield captain Conor Hourihane.............as are Villa & Sevco :lolhuns:
I'd be stunned if we signed Hourihane. Quality player.
I will never be stunned by us signing a player from Barnsley.
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The Wizard of Tim
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esme stuart
14 Sep 2016, 11:34 AM
Govan Super Casino
14 Sep 2016, 10:34 AM
esme stuart
14 Sep 2016, 09:59 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
----Bitton

Forrest-Brown-Armstrong-Sinclair

There's 5 MF's for you and Rogic and Roberts on the bench. We had 6 MF's available that are in good to very good form.
Ryan Christie, Kris Commons, Scott Allen, GMS,..there's another 4 for you, all with admirable set skills that unfortunately don't include defensive capabilities. Another post pointed out the 0-1 reverse recently had Ledley and Wanyama in there who were able to offer protection to a defence that included Efe.

My point is, of the 12 or so mids on our books, only Brown and Bitton are recognised as POTENTIALLY having defensive qualities...and frankly my heart sinks when these 2 are paired together.

We need to revamp the midfield in January so that some are replaced with guys that realise part of the remit of that area of the team is to offer protection to the defence.
Totally agree but I think BR knows it too- This will not be our midfield for CL qualifiers next year
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tinytim81
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Midfield Maestro
14 Sep 2016, 11:57 AM
tinytim81
14 Sep 2016, 11:49 AM
Midfield Maestro
14 Sep 2016, 09:28 AM
He got it wrong last night by not putting more bodies in the midfield, but he's just in the door and the squad still needs some rebuilding.

I think I'm right in saying that by this stage in each of O'Neill's, Strachan's and Lennon's first seasons we were already out of Europe altogether. And obviously no other Celtic manager has qualified for the Champions League group stages in his first season. So, he's ahead of schedule and I think this season should be viewed as a learning experience for Brendan and for those players he will build his Celtic team around.

Managing Celtic in Europe is a learning curve. Eking our results in Europe with a squad which costs £15 million against squads which cost ten or twenty times that (and more) is something Strachan and Lennon had to learn to do. And they did learn to do it, for the most part. The financial disparity is growing - and it has certainly grown massively since O'Neill's time - which is all the more reason why qualifying this year was so important.

I actually don't think we're a million miles away from being a team which could compete at this level and potentially qualify for the last 16 (if we don't get a horror show of a draw like this year). We need a better defensive shape - that will come. And we need a Boruc/Forster and a Wanyama.
I agree although I'm not sure if we'll ever manage to get into the knockout stages again unless we improve dramatically and get a half decent draw.

It's amazing to think in the last twelve years we have drawn Barcelona in Europe seven or eight times and within that period (from Guardiola through to the present day) they have basically become the greatest football team of all time.

Brutal that we're always up against them.
We've got through to the last 16 with a team including Caldwell, McManus, Naylor, Telfer, Hartley and Robson. We can do it again.

It will take lots of improvement (particularly when it comes to our defensive shape), a few quality additions to the squad and a lot more nous, which will come by playing at this level. It is beyond us this year but it is not beyond us in structural terms (yet).
My concern is that Rodgers just doesn't set his teams up to win ugly. He always tries to get the goals which is great but sometimes you just have to park a tank.

We've conceded in ten out of twelve games. I'm not sure the defence will ever look really good no matter who we bring in. Still, it's very exciting.
Edited by tinytim81, 14 Sep 2016, 12:22 PM.
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Haitch
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Biggest mistake he made last night for me was playing De Vries. We were never going to have a lot of possession therefore we should have played our best shot stopper.
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SuperHans67
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I was happy enough with the team, he probably would have went with another midfielder had we signed one. Gamboa was poor but he's just in the door.

I don't think the 5 other games will be anything like that, Barca are on another level even from City imo and we will be able to assert ourselves in the next 3 games.

Agree with Flawless on the goalkeeper, I think he could have been better last night. Didn't move his feet for the free kick at all.
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Kingslim
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BardseyCelt
14 Sep 2016, 07:34 AM
Kingslim
14 Sep 2016, 12:10 AM
Tonight shouldn't be a stick to beat him with but a little worried we've yet to get a decent away performance from his team.

Astana we got a draw but were fortunate to do so.

it's a shame he's overseen the two worst European results in our history.
We got thumped but it's nowhere near one of our worst results. The gap between us and Barca is beyond measure. Getting pumped off relative minnows in Europe like Bratislava was far, far worse than last night
The record books don't care if it's Barca or Bratislava 7-0 is our record European defeat, throw in the Imps then you have the two worst results we've ever had.
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tinytim81
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SuperHans67
14 Sep 2016, 02:46 PM
I was happy enough with the team, he probably would have went with another midfielder had we signed one. Gamboa was poor but he's just in the door.

I don't think the 5 other games will be anything like that, Barca are on another level even from City imo and we will be able to assert ourselves in the next 3 games.

Agree with Flawless on the goalkeeper, I think he could have been better last night. Didn't move his feet for the free kick at all.
Barca are on another level even from City imo and we will be able to assert ourselves in the next 3 games

This is my hope as well. Maybe we can land a few blows.
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rastabhoy
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14 Sep 2016, 12:24 PM
Biggest mistake he made last night for me was playing De Vries. We were never going to have a lot of possession therefore we should have played our best shot stopper.
Hear, hear. Not an impressive start to his Celtic career.
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Paul Allen
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Someone said it in the pre-match thread but theoretically a least - though obviously it's different in an actual game - playing 3/5 at the back is the wrong move against a 4-3-3. You end up with too many spare men in defence and not enough bodies elsewhere (midfield), which is even more pronounced against a side who don't use a proper centre-forward The back 3 were often standing in a line with no one to mark, with Barca's runners coming from deep. Would have made more sense to pack midfield but as others have said, not many options there. It also might not have made much difference to the fact they looked frightened by the occasion.
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The Gorbals Urchin
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Really needs to get the defence and midfield tighter for
Europe.
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hazy
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Kingslim
14 Sep 2016, 02:49 PM
BardseyCelt
14 Sep 2016, 07:34 AM
Kingslim
14 Sep 2016, 12:10 AM
Tonight shouldn't be a stick to beat him with but a little worried we've yet to get a decent away performance from his team.

Astana we got a draw but were fortunate to do so.

it's a shame he's overseen the two worst European results in our history.
We got thumped but it's nowhere near one of our worst results. The gap between us and Barca is beyond measure. Getting pumped off relative minnows in Europe like Bratislava was far, far worse than last night
The record books don't care if it's Barca or Bratislava 7-0 is our record European defeat, throw in the Imps then you have the two worst results we've ever had.
What record books are these?

If they happen to exist they need to sort their methodology out, as context seems to matter for the Imps result but is ignored for Barcelona

:comp:
Edited by hazy, 14 Sep 2016, 05:44 PM.
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riclaroc
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14 Sep 2016, 11:59 AM
OzzyBhoy
14 Sep 2016, 11:53 AM
tonyjaa-csc
14 Sep 2016, 07:36 AM
According to the BBC gossip page he's interested in
Barnsley centre midfield captain Conor Hourihane.............as are Villa & Sevco :lolhuns:
I'd be stunned if we signed Hourihane. Quality player.
I will never be stunned by us signing a player from Barnsley.
What if we were to sign Janko ... ?
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