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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,414,495 Views)
qualitystreetkid
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Thank you, bye-bye for calling
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In my inbox this morning - a new blog by Rangers Tax Case - probably better here than in the actual hun thread

Long but very informative

FTT Transcript for Andrew Dickson
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Dubz
Getting on a bit
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idyllwild
8 Sep 2017, 07:06 AM
Auldyin
8 Sep 2017, 12:23 AM
Thought I'd check on KDS comments.

:notmissingthis:

The universe is unfolding as it should.

Re events in 2011 there is no doubt RFC lied about status of liability at 31st March before CW took over and that CW continued with same lie to avoid UEFA enquiry.

No doubt.

What is not clear is how much the SFA were complict or negligent in their handling of the granting and monitoring duties.

Key date is 19 Sept 2011 when SFA and UEFA discussed the June submission under Article 66.

That led to UEFA verbally accepting the submission in spite of it borrowing on the same falsehood that allowed the licence to be granted.

Did someone at SFA lie to UEFA or just accept what he was told by RFC without checking with HMRC as he was empowered to do?

Stay Sharp on this and the advice provided to RFC on the next submission under Art67.

It's as if RFC were being coached.
I see what you did there. :ph43r:
He's the scapegoat. All the rest will shrug their shooders and watch him suffer to save their own arses.
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DICEMAN
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Everyone's Fantasy Football first pick
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Ffdiva
7 Sep 2017, 08:53 PM
BardseyCelt
7 Sep 2017, 06:49 PM
The SFA say that "raking over the coals" can only "damage the reputation of Scottish football further"

Shameless
But letting cheating & corruption go unpunished isn't damaging at all of course.

It's the cover up that always gets them.
I think that statement shows how much they're shampooting it and they're definitely not wrong about the reputation of Scottish Football.

They're hanging on by their finger nails now.

Go get them Celtic.

Stupid corrupt carrots
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aldo
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And that's the way we like it...
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MILLIGANS ISLAND
8 Sep 2017, 08:16 AM
qualitystreetkid
8 Sep 2017, 08:11 AM
It should be astonishing that after so many years of misfeasance, misconduct and general wrongdoing the SFA now have the balls to intimate their delinquency but decide no investigation is required ... but it's really not astonishing at all, it's not even mildly surprising
Its utterly incredible. It really is.

The sheer brass neck of these carrots is breathtaking.
Generation after generation of those masonic bastards got away with running the game as they saw fit, with nothing more critical from the press than the odd jibe about 'think tanks'. Glorified bowling club officials, guaranteed a slow but sure progression to offices they would not be fit to hold in an open market, as long as they toed the line and stayed on the square. Like their arrogant Brethren at Ibrox, getting away with it is all they have known, so it's maybe not so surprising they are so brazen.
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van Doesburg
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Brucebhoy
7 Sep 2017, 11:22 PM
They've blinked.
:thumbsup:

Really pleased to see things developing.

Needs to go all the way, though.
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aldo
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And that's the way we like it...
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Questions on what Celtic/complaining clubs can do:

- who or what determines if a Judicial Review can take place?
- is JR the 'best' method of ensuring a fair and thorough investigation, or are there other options?
- would a JR or other independent investigation determine actions/punishments, and are they enforceable?
- would a JR compel all parties to take part, or could SFA/anyone opt out?

The gist of what I'm asking is: can the SFA get away with carrying on ignoring this, and just brass-neck it out it out?
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qualitystreetkid
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Thank you, bye-bye for calling
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aldo
8 Sep 2017, 08:57 AM
Questions on what Celtic/complaining clubs can do:

- who or what determines if a Judicial Review can take place?
- is JR the 'best' method of ensuring a fair and thorough investigation, or are there other options?
- would a JR or other independent investigation determine actions/punishments, and are they enforceable?
- would a JR compel all parties to take part, or could SFA/anyone opt out?

The gist of what I'm asking is: can the SFA get away with carrying on ignoring this, and just brass-neck it out it out?
If it's about changing an outcome then perhaps a Judicial Review isn't the best route.
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exiledinstonehaventim
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Happy to see Lawell has been properly on this. I'm assuming the advice they got after the Nimmo-Smith fiasco/whitewash that they would need to see it through until BTC was done.

So here we are and SFA are (rightly) shampooting a brick.

Be very interesting to see the next step Celtic take.
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Gothamcelt
Retired and now a BT Sports pundit
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Well it looks like PL sent his letter, from 2012, to UEFA at the same time as he sent it to the SFA.
No surprise that Infantino hasn't done anything, he would probably agree with what the Huns did. Corrupt bastard.

LETTER OF THE LAW Read every word of Celtic chief Peter Lawwell’s ‘Rangers EBT’ letter to SFA boss Stewart Regan and then-Uefa supremo Gianni Infantino
Lawwell's secret letter - sent just months before Gers' liquidation - hinted that title-stripping should be an option in probe into EBT saga
Spoiler: click to toggle
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Wanyerma
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Considering retirement
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qualitystreetkid
8 Sep 2017, 09:05 AM
aldo
8 Sep 2017, 08:57 AM
Questions on what Celtic/complaining clubs can do:

- who or what determines if a Judicial Review can take place?
- is JR the 'best' method of ensuring a fair and thorough investigation, or are there other options?
- would a JR or other independent investigation determine actions/punishments, and are they enforceable?
- would a JR compel all parties to take part, or could SFA/anyone opt out?

The gist of what I'm asking is: can the SFA get away with carrying on ignoring this, and just brass-neck it out it out?
If it's about changing an outcome then perhaps a Judicial Review isn't the best route.
I've always felt this would have to see us taking SFA to court. Hence my doubts that we'd actually do it.
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Roland
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Club Captain
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aldo
8 Sep 2017, 08:57 AM
Questions on what Celtic/complaining clubs can do:

- who or what determines if a Judicial Review can take place?
- is JR the 'best' method of ensuring a fair and thorough investigation, or are there other options?
- would a JR or other independent investigation determine actions/punishments, and are they enforceable?
- would a JR compel all parties to take part, or could SFA/anyone opt out?

The gist of what I'm asking is: can the SFA get away with carrying on ignoring this, and just brass-neck it out it out?
A JR takes place in court (Court of Session in this case). There are rules about standing (who can bring a JR) and scope (what can be JR'd): Scots law has much broader rules of standing than it used to (and Celtic would be fine either way, as would - on the best understanding of the law - a fans group, I think). Scots law also has funny rules about the scope of JR (so in England you can't JR a private body but you can in Scotland). This is presumably within scope.

More problematic is that there are now quite strict time limits in Scotland for bringing a JR - depending on exactly what was being JR'd, I suspect Celtic may be out of time (unless the JR is of the decision communicated yesterday, and is brought in the next few weeks). Going back in time to 2012 or whenever will be more or less impossible.

A JR would (at best) say that, by the rules governing their decision-making a party had acted unlawfully - either as a matter of not following those rules, or adopting an illegal procedure, or (in extreme cases) because the decision or act in question was irrational. JR doesn't see a judge substitute his own decision though - he gets the original decision-maker to remake the decision, this time lawfully. What that would mean in practice would depend on the reason that the decision was held to be unlawful, whether it was procedural or substantive.

If you are JRing the SFA, they have no option to not take part.

JR will not determine punishments directly.
Edited by Roland, 8 Sep 2017, 09:25 AM.
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puroresu_boy
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The game in Scotland is a joke. The quality on the pitch is on thing but the running of the game from administrators is what really makes it a footballing backwater.

That statement from Regan is disgraceful and its unreal that a governing body could release such a thing. You cant just bury things hoping they go away when people want answers. In any country where the press is free and actually does there job without bias this whole saga would of been over by now. The Press wouldn't stop digging until the matter came to a fair and just conclusion and a Footballing Association would have no place to escape. In Scotland however the governing body can release a statement like they have done and I suspect the media will just move on or in some cases argue that 'raking over the coals' is as the SFA said a detriment to the game.

If this happened down here it wouldn't matter who the club was there is just no way the press would accept whatever the FA said. They would be baying for blood trying to find the details which could implicate whoever as good stories drive traffic to news media.

We are fighting this battle alone and the sooner we can get out of the cesspit of Scottish Football the better.
Edited by puroresu_boy, 8 Sep 2017, 09:26 AM.
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MILLIGANS ISLAND
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Wanyerma
8 Sep 2017, 09:17 AM
qualitystreetkid
8 Sep 2017, 09:05 AM
aldo
8 Sep 2017, 08:57 AM
Questions on what Celtic/complaining clubs can do:

- who or what determines if a Judicial Review can take place?
- is JR the 'best' method of ensuring a fair and thorough investigation, or are there other options?
- would a JR or other independent investigation determine actions/punishments, and are they enforceable?
- would a JR compel all parties to take part, or could SFA/anyone opt out?

The gist of what I'm asking is: can the SFA get away with carrying on ignoring this, and just brass-neck it out it out?
If it's about changing an outcome then perhaps a Judicial Review isn't the best route.
I've always felt this would have to see us taking SFA to court. Hence my doubts that we'd actually do it.
Wouldn't that see us in bother with UEFA ?
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remy mcswain
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Big in Canada
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MILLIGANS ISLAND
8 Sep 2017, 09:29 AM
Wanyerma
8 Sep 2017, 09:17 AM
qualitystreetkid
8 Sep 2017, 09:05 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I've always felt this would have to see us taking SFA to court. Hence my doubts that we'd actually do it.
Wouldn't that see us in bother with UEFA ?
The Huns took the SFA to court. Don't recall UEFA getting involved.
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Wanyerma
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Considering retirement
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remy mcswain
8 Sep 2017, 09:40 AM
MILLIGANS ISLAND
8 Sep 2017, 09:29 AM
Wanyerma
8 Sep 2017, 09:17 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Wouldn't that see us in bother with UEFA ?
The Huns took the SFA to court. Don't recall UEFA getting involved.
We did too under Fergus re Farrie if I recall correctly?
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Brucebhoy
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Two thoughts -

Re the SFA - back in 2012, when there was a lot of pressure put on the SFA to investigate the huns cheating, the SFA put it out that they couldn't investigate because they were the body of appeal for the LNS enquiry and had to remain neutral. This was coming from Regan. Of course, we didn't know then how pivotal the SFA evidence was going to be in stopping the huns getting punished. Point is, there's nothing the SFA says that can be believed on this matter.

- I wonder if one of the reasons why Celtic is pushing on this now is because of the way Albion Rovers got hammered recently. It's brought home to the wee clubs that there's one set of rules for Ibrox and another set of rules for everybody else. Has Celtic spoken to some of those clubs and been given support?
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Tam Haas
Getting on a bit
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The huns think there is some sort of massive conspiracy AGAINST them.

Just let that sink in.
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shugmc
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I was there
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Tam Haas
8 Sep 2017, 09:53 AM
The huns think there is some sort of massive conspiracy AGAINST them.

Just let that sink in.
Well, if you'd had years and years of getting it up Timmy, while some book-cooking, embezzling carrot was telling you that it will always be this way, and WATP, btw, you would, wouldn't you?
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puroresu_boy
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qualitystreetkid
8 Sep 2017, 08:17 AM
In my inbox this morning - a new blog by Rangers Tax Case - probably better here than in the actual hun thread

Long but very informative

FTT Transcript for Andrew Dickson
There was enough in there for game, set, match.

The reasons he tried to give for not lodging details with the SFA are laughable.
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murphio
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Kudos to Auldyin. He has been like a dog with a bone on the UEFA license and here is the SFA forced into admitting it was a complete stitchup. Respect.
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