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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
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Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,414,502 Views)
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Gunner
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7 Sep 2017, 02:51 PM
Post #10401
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I'll play anywhere, as long as I get a game!
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- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:48 PM
Times article for anyone interested: Celtic still pressing SFA for inquiryLawwell letter from 2012 outlines stance Spoiler: click to toggle Celtic have not given up hope of the Scottish Football Association agreeing to a judicial inquiry which would examine fully the roles played by the game’s ruling bodies before, during and after the financial implosion of Rangers in 2012.
It is understood that, while the SFA have yet to respond to a call from the Ladbrokes Premiership champions for such a forensic investigation some two months ago, Celtic believe that more stringent rules, checks and balances ought to be in place in order to restore confidence in the SFA while simultaneously ensuring that Rangers or any other club are not allowed to run up such unsustainable debts in future.
The Times can also reveal that, in an letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan, the SFA’s chief executive, immediately prior to Rangers descending from administration into liquidation five years ago, the Celtic chief executive not only demanded a judicial review of the scandal which rocked the national sport but also insisted that title-stripping and the removal of national cup competitions won by the fallen Glasgow club between 1999 and 2010 should form part of the sanctions open to that panel.
During those years, Sir David Murray had employed tax avoidance policies: firstly, the Discounted Option Scheme, for which they admitted liability, and secondly, the Employee Benefit Trusts, for which they did not. The deployment of these complex plans allowed Rangers to make tax-free payments to players, managers, staff and former employees in the shape of “loans” or discretionary bonuses from the Trust.
Murray took £6.3 million worth of net payments in EBTs while other major beneficiaries included Barry Ferguson (£2.5 million), Stefan Klos (£2 million), Dado Prso (£1.9 million), Christian Nerlinger (£1.8 million), Michael Ball (£1.4 million), Tore André Flo (£1.3 million), Ronald de Boer and Thomas Buffel (£1.2 million each), Claudio Caniggia and Pedro Mendes (£1 million each) and managers Alex McLeish (£1.7 million) and Dick Advocaat (£1.5 million).
Celtic believed then that the involvement of the aforementioned players, along with 46 others, in league and cup matches during that 11-year span should make all their results null and void, should it be proved that the tax avoidance schemes had been misused.
“If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
It adds: “The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Five Supreme Court judges decided unanimously on July 5 that EBT payments were liable for tax. Rangers had denied the existence of side letters to players guaranteeing their extra payments — most of them were performance-related — to Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the footballing authorities but they were uncovered during a police raid on Ibrox.
Murray confessed in court earlier this year that EBTs “gave us [Rangers] an opportunity to get players that we perhaps would not be able to afford [otherwise]”. When the Supreme Court verdict was announced, the SFA issued a statement which said they would do nothing, on legal advice.
The SPFL board — it includes Rangers’ Stewart Robertson — also asked the SFA more than six weeks ago to consent to an impartial probe into how the governing bodies dealt with Rangers’ financial meltdown. It too has been met with silence. And if this is the first 'leak' or letter to be dropped in the lap of a journo... I wonder what other correspondance there's been.
Would there be any reason to connect the timing of this and his inclusion on the board of the European Club Associations Executive Board?
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He Cometh
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7 Sep 2017, 03:05 PM
Post #10402
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First name on the team-sheet
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- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:51 PM
- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:48 PM
Times article for anyone interested: Celtic still pressing SFA for inquiryLawwell letter from 2012 outlines stance Spoiler: click to toggle Celtic have not given up hope of the Scottish Football Association agreeing to a judicial inquiry which would examine fully the roles played by the game’s ruling bodies before, during and after the financial implosion of Rangers in 2012.
It is understood that, while the SFA have yet to respond to a call from the Ladbrokes Premiership champions for such a forensic investigation some two months ago, Celtic believe that more stringent rules, checks and balances ought to be in place in order to restore confidence in the SFA while simultaneously ensuring that Rangers or any other club are not allowed to run up such unsustainable debts in future.
The Times can also reveal that, in an letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan, the SFA’s chief executive, immediately prior to Rangers descending from administration into liquidation five years ago, the Celtic chief executive not only demanded a judicial review of the scandal which rocked the national sport but also insisted that title-stripping and the removal of national cup competitions won by the fallen Glasgow club between 1999 and 2010 should form part of the sanctions open to that panel.
During those years, Sir David Murray had employed tax avoidance policies: firstly, the Discounted Option Scheme, for which they admitted liability, and secondly, the Employee Benefit Trusts, for which they did not. The deployment of these complex plans allowed Rangers to make tax-free payments to players, managers, staff and former employees in the shape of “loans” or discretionary bonuses from the Trust.
Murray took £6.3 million worth of net payments in EBTs while other major beneficiaries included Barry Ferguson (£2.5 million), Stefan Klos (£2 million), Dado Prso (£1.9 million), Christian Nerlinger (£1.8 million), Michael Ball (£1.4 million), Tore André Flo (£1.3 million), Ronald de Boer and Thomas Buffel (£1.2 million each), Claudio Caniggia and Pedro Mendes (£1 million each) and managers Alex McLeish (£1.7 million) and Dick Advocaat (£1.5 million).
Celtic believed then that the involvement of the aforementioned players, along with 46 others, in league and cup matches during that 11-year span should make all their results null and void, should it be proved that the tax avoidance schemes had been misused.
“If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
It adds: “The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Five Supreme Court judges decided unanimously on July 5 that EBT payments were liable for tax. Rangers had denied the existence of side letters to players guaranteeing their extra payments — most of them were performance-related — to Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the footballing authorities but they were uncovered during a police raid on Ibrox.
Murray confessed in court earlier this year that EBTs “gave us [Rangers] an opportunity to get players that we perhaps would not be able to afford [otherwise]”. When the Supreme Court verdict was announced, the SFA issued a statement which said they would do nothing, on legal advice.
The SPFL board — it includes Rangers’ Stewart Robertson — also asked the SFA more than six weeks ago to consent to an impartial probe into how the governing bodies dealt with Rangers’ financial meltdown. It too has been met with silence.
And if this is the first 'leak' or letter to be dropped in the lap of a journo... I wonder what other correspondance there's been. Would there be any reason to connect the timing of this and his inclusion on the board of the European Club Associations Executive Board? Every chance.
Is it Lawwell telling the SFA that this is their last chance before he takes it higher?
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littlegmbhoy
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7 Sep 2017, 03:15 PM
Post #10403
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- He Cometh
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:05 PM
- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:51 PM
- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:48 PM
Times article for anyone interested: Celtic still pressing SFA for inquiryLawwell letter from 2012 outlines stance Spoiler: click to toggle Celtic have not given up hope of the Scottish Football Association agreeing to a judicial inquiry which would examine fully the roles played by the game’s ruling bodies before, during and after the financial implosion of Rangers in 2012.
It is understood that, while the SFA have yet to respond to a call from the Ladbrokes Premiership champions for such a forensic investigation some two months ago, Celtic believe that more stringent rules, checks and balances ought to be in place in order to restore confidence in the SFA while simultaneously ensuring that Rangers or any other club are not allowed to run up such unsustainable debts in future.
The Times can also reveal that, in an letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan, the SFA’s chief executive, immediately prior to Rangers descending from administration into liquidation five years ago, the Celtic chief executive not only demanded a judicial review of the scandal which rocked the national sport but also insisted that title-stripping and the removal of national cup competitions won by the fallen Glasgow club between 1999 and 2010 should form part of the sanctions open to that panel.
During those years, Sir David Murray had employed tax avoidance policies: firstly, the Discounted Option Scheme, for which they admitted liability, and secondly, the Employee Benefit Trusts, for which they did not. The deployment of these complex plans allowed Rangers to make tax-free payments to players, managers, staff and former employees in the shape of “loans” or discretionary bonuses from the Trust.
Murray took £6.3 million worth of net payments in EBTs while other major beneficiaries included Barry Ferguson (£2.5 million), Stefan Klos (£2 million), Dado Prso (£1.9 million), Christian Nerlinger (£1.8 million), Michael Ball (£1.4 million), Tore André Flo (£1.3 million), Ronald de Boer and Thomas Buffel (£1.2 million each), Claudio Caniggia and Pedro Mendes (£1 million each) and managers Alex McLeish (£1.7 million) and Dick Advocaat (£1.5 million).
Celtic believed then that the involvement of the aforementioned players, along with 46 others, in league and cup matches during that 11-year span should make all their results null and void, should it be proved that the tax avoidance schemes had been misused.
“If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
It adds: “The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Five Supreme Court judges decided unanimously on July 5 that EBT payments were liable for tax. Rangers had denied the existence of side letters to players guaranteeing their extra payments — most of them were performance-related — to Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the footballing authorities but they were uncovered during a police raid on Ibrox.
Murray confessed in court earlier this year that EBTs “gave us [Rangers] an opportunity to get players that we perhaps would not be able to afford [otherwise]”. When the Supreme Court verdict was announced, the SFA issued a statement which said they would do nothing, on legal advice.
The SPFL board — it includes Rangers’ Stewart Robertson — also asked the SFA more than six weeks ago to consent to an impartial probe into how the governing bodies dealt with Rangers’ financial meltdown. It too has been met with silence.
And if this is the first 'leak' or letter to be dropped in the lap of a journo... I wonder what other correspondance there's been. Would there be any reason to connect the timing of this and his inclusion on the board of the European Club Associations Executive Board?
Every chance. Is it Lawwell telling the SFA that this is their last chance before he takes it higher? This letter is from 2012?????
Can he/the board not release something just now that is up to date in line with recent events??
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Bodom Bhoy
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7 Sep 2017, 03:16 PM
Post #10404
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- littlegmbhoy
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:15 PM
- He Cometh
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:05 PM
- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:51 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep Celtic still pressing SFA for inquiryLawwell letter from 2012 outlines stance Spoiler: click to toggle Celtic have not given up hope of the Scottish Football Association agreeing to a judicial inquiry which would examine fully the roles played by the game’s ruling bodies before, during and after the financial implosion of Rangers in 2012.
It is understood that, while the SFA have yet to respond to a call from the Ladbrokes Premiership champions for such a forensic investigation some two months ago, Celtic believe that more stringent rules, checks and balances ought to be in place in order to restore confidence in the SFA while simultaneously ensuring that Rangers or any other club are not allowed to run up such unsustainable debts in future.
The Times can also reveal that, in an letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan, the SFA’s chief executive, immediately prior to Rangers descending from administration into liquidation five years ago, the Celtic chief executive not only demanded a judicial review of the scandal which rocked the national sport but also insisted that title-stripping and the removal of national cup competitions won by the fallen Glasgow club between 1999 and 2010 should form part of the sanctions open to that panel.
During those years, Sir David Murray had employed tax avoidance policies: firstly, the Discounted Option Scheme, for which they admitted liability, and secondly, the Employee Benefit Trusts, for which they did not. The deployment of these complex plans allowed Rangers to make tax-free payments to players, managers, staff and former employees in the shape of “loans” or discretionary bonuses from the Trust.
Murray took £6.3 million worth of net payments in EBTs while other major beneficiaries included Barry Ferguson (£2.5 million), Stefan Klos (£2 million), Dado Prso (£1.9 million), Christian Nerlinger (£1.8 million), Michael Ball (£1.4 million), Tore André Flo (£1.3 million), Ronald de Boer and Thomas Buffel (£1.2 million each), Claudio Caniggia and Pedro Mendes (£1 million each) and managers Alex McLeish (£1.7 million) and Dick Advocaat (£1.5 million).
Celtic believed then that the involvement of the aforementioned players, along with 46 others, in league and cup matches during that 11-year span should make all their results null and void, should it be proved that the tax avoidance schemes had been misused.
“If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
It adds: “The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Five Supreme Court judges decided unanimously on July 5 that EBT payments were liable for tax. Rangers had denied the existence of side letters to players guaranteeing their extra payments — most of them were performance-related — to Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the footballing authorities but they were uncovered during a police raid on Ibrox.
Murray confessed in court earlier this year that EBTs “gave us [Rangers] an opportunity to get players that we perhaps would not be able to afford [otherwise]”. When the Supreme Court verdict was announced, the SFA issued a statement which said they would do nothing, on legal advice.
The SPFL board — it includes Rangers’ Stewart Robertson — also asked the SFA more than six weeks ago to consent to an impartial probe into how the governing bodies dealt with Rangers’ financial meltdown. It too has been met with silence.
Every chance. Is it Lawwell telling the SFA that this is their last chance before he takes it higher?
This letter is from 2012????? Can he/the board not release something just now that is up to date in line with recent events?? This one being leaked can show that they've always been on it.
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He Cometh
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7 Sep 2017, 03:17 PM
Post #10405
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First name on the team-sheet
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- littlegmbhoy
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:15 PM
- He Cometh
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:05 PM
- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:51 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep Celtic still pressing SFA for inquiryLawwell letter from 2012 outlines stance Spoiler: click to toggle Celtic have not given up hope of the Scottish Football Association agreeing to a judicial inquiry which would examine fully the roles played by the game’s ruling bodies before, during and after the financial implosion of Rangers in 2012.
It is understood that, while the SFA have yet to respond to a call from the Ladbrokes Premiership champions for such a forensic investigation some two months ago, Celtic believe that more stringent rules, checks and balances ought to be in place in order to restore confidence in the SFA while simultaneously ensuring that Rangers or any other club are not allowed to run up such unsustainable debts in future.
The Times can also reveal that, in an letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan, the SFA’s chief executive, immediately prior to Rangers descending from administration into liquidation five years ago, the Celtic chief executive not only demanded a judicial review of the scandal which rocked the national sport but also insisted that title-stripping and the removal of national cup competitions won by the fallen Glasgow club between 1999 and 2010 should form part of the sanctions open to that panel.
During those years, Sir David Murray had employed tax avoidance policies: firstly, the Discounted Option Scheme, for which they admitted liability, and secondly, the Employee Benefit Trusts, for which they did not. The deployment of these complex plans allowed Rangers to make tax-free payments to players, managers, staff and former employees in the shape of “loans” or discretionary bonuses from the Trust.
Murray took £6.3 million worth of net payments in EBTs while other major beneficiaries included Barry Ferguson (£2.5 million), Stefan Klos (£2 million), Dado Prso (£1.9 million), Christian Nerlinger (£1.8 million), Michael Ball (£1.4 million), Tore André Flo (£1.3 million), Ronald de Boer and Thomas Buffel (£1.2 million each), Claudio Caniggia and Pedro Mendes (£1 million each) and managers Alex McLeish (£1.7 million) and Dick Advocaat (£1.5 million).
Celtic believed then that the involvement of the aforementioned players, along with 46 others, in league and cup matches during that 11-year span should make all their results null and void, should it be proved that the tax avoidance schemes had been misused.
“If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
It adds: “The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Five Supreme Court judges decided unanimously on July 5 that EBT payments were liable for tax. Rangers had denied the existence of side letters to players guaranteeing their extra payments — most of them were performance-related — to Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the footballing authorities but they were uncovered during a police raid on Ibrox.
Murray confessed in court earlier this year that EBTs “gave us [Rangers] an opportunity to get players that we perhaps would not be able to afford [otherwise]”. When the Supreme Court verdict was announced, the SFA issued a statement which said they would do nothing, on legal advice.
The SPFL board — it includes Rangers’ Stewart Robertson — also asked the SFA more than six weeks ago to consent to an impartial probe into how the governing bodies dealt with Rangers’ financial meltdown. It too has been met with silence.
Every chance. Is it Lawwell telling the SFA that this is their last chance before he takes it higher?
This letter is from 2012????? Can he/the board not release something just now that is up to date in line with recent events?? I know
It's been released to rank the pressure up and is the first step. Celtic put another request of the same nature in just 2 months ago.
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Sheshoon
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7 Sep 2017, 03:19 PM
Post #10406
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First name on the team-sheet
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- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:51 PM
- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:48 PM
Times article for anyone interested: Celtic still pressing SFA for inquiryLawwell letter from 2012 outlines stance Spoiler: click to toggle Celtic have not given up hope of the Scottish Football Association agreeing to a judicial inquiry which would examine fully the roles played by the game’s ruling bodies before, during and after the financial implosion of Rangers in 2012.
It is understood that, while the SFA have yet to respond to a call from the Ladbrokes Premiership champions for such a forensic investigation some two months ago, Celtic believe that more stringent rules, checks and balances ought to be in place in order to restore confidence in the SFA while simultaneously ensuring that Rangers or any other club are not allowed to run up such unsustainable debts in future.
The Times can also reveal that, in an letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan, the SFA’s chief executive, immediately prior to Rangers descending from administration into liquidation five years ago, the Celtic chief executive not only demanded a judicial review of the scandal which rocked the national sport but also insisted that title-stripping and the removal of national cup competitions won by the fallen Glasgow club between 1999 and 2010 should form part of the sanctions open to that panel.
During those years, Sir David Murray had employed tax avoidance policies: firstly, the Discounted Option Scheme, for which they admitted liability, and secondly, the Employee Benefit Trusts, for which they did not. The deployment of these complex plans allowed Rangers to make tax-free payments to players, managers, staff and former employees in the shape of “loans” or discretionary bonuses from the Trust.
Murray took £6.3 million worth of net payments in EBTs while other major beneficiaries included Barry Ferguson (£2.5 million), Stefan Klos (£2 million), Dado Prso (£1.9 million), Christian Nerlinger (£1.8 million), Michael Ball (£1.4 million), Tore André Flo (£1.3 million), Ronald de Boer and Thomas Buffel (£1.2 million each), Claudio Caniggia and Pedro Mendes (£1 million each) and managers Alex McLeish (£1.7 million) and Dick Advocaat (£1.5 million).
Celtic believed then that the involvement of the aforementioned players, along with 46 others, in league and cup matches during that 11-year span should make all their results null and void, should it be proved that the tax avoidance schemes had been misused.
“If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
It adds: “The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Five Supreme Court judges decided unanimously on July 5 that EBT payments were liable for tax. Rangers had denied the existence of side letters to players guaranteeing their extra payments — most of them were performance-related — to Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the footballing authorities but they were uncovered during a police raid on Ibrox.
Murray confessed in court earlier this year that EBTs “gave us [Rangers] an opportunity to get players that we perhaps would not be able to afford [otherwise]”. When the Supreme Court verdict was announced, the SFA issued a statement which said they would do nothing, on legal advice.
The SPFL board — it includes Rangers’ Stewart Robertson — also asked the SFA more than six weeks ago to consent to an impartial probe into how the governing bodies dealt with Rangers’ financial meltdown. It too has been met with silence.
And if this is the first 'leak' or letter to be dropped in the lap of a journo... I wonder what other correspondance there's been. Would there be any reason to connect the timing of this and his inclusion on the board of the European Club Associations Executive Board? The "leak" certainly has come hot on the heals of Pistol Pete joining the ECA's board.
I find it hard to believe that any move by Celtic in relation to challenging Sevco/SFA/SPFL, isn't very carefully timed and placed. Not sure though what additional advantage if any PL could bring to bear through his membership of the ECA. Is it a vehicle through which he is going to try and persuade UEFA to take a more active interest in the whole EBT, Res 12, FFP situation - I've nae idea. I know pretty much feck all about these ECA cats. Could just be coincidence and merely PL furthering the profile of CFC on the Euro stage.
However, I am sure that the Zombies will be absolutely convinced that it's further evidence of Pistol Pete not just running Scottish fitba, but Euro Fitba aswell....and that quietly pleases me
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Tenenbaum
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7 Sep 2017, 03:35 PM
Post #10407
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Anybody interested in grabbing a couple of burgers and hittin' the cemetery?
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How is this letter supposed to relate to the Nimmo Smith whitewash? Nimmo Smith was appointed in Feb 2012, before Lawwell wrote this letter which is being reported as being sent 'just' prior to the Huns exiting administration and entering liquidation - so definitely post February 2012 but pre Halloween 2012. (Just re-read this and the Lawwell letter was allegedly sent on 25/05/2012 - nice touch, if it's true; but I've learned to doubt everything I read in the MSM.)
Is Lawwell calling for a different inquiry in this letter? Why is he calling for an independent judge-led inquiry in May, when LNS was appointed previously in February of that year, but didn't make his conclusions until 28th February 2013.
Am I going mad, or does this letter raise a lot more questions than it answers?
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Wailer
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7 Sep 2017, 03:37 PM
Post #10408
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- Gunner
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:48 PM
Times article for anyone interested: Celtic still pressing SFA for inquiryLawwell letter from 2012 outlines stance Spoiler: click to toggle Celtic have not given up hope of the Scottish Football Association agreeing to a judicial inquiry which would examine fully the roles played by the game’s ruling bodies before, during and after the financial implosion of Rangers in 2012.
It is understood that, while the SFA have yet to respond to a call from the Ladbrokes Premiership champions for such a forensic investigation some two months ago, Celtic believe that more stringent rules, checks and balances ought to be in place in order to restore confidence in the SFA while simultaneously ensuring that Rangers or any other club are not allowed to run up such unsustainable debts in future.
The Times can also reveal that, in an letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan, the SFA’s chief executive, immediately prior to Rangers descending from administration into liquidation five years ago, the Celtic chief executive not only demanded a judicial review of the scandal which rocked the national sport but also insisted that title-stripping and the removal of national cup competitions won by the fallen Glasgow club between 1999 and 2010 should form part of the sanctions open to that panel.
During those years, Sir David Murray had employed tax avoidance policies: firstly, the Discounted Option Scheme, for which they admitted liability, and secondly, the Employee Benefit Trusts, for which they did not. The deployment of these complex plans allowed Rangers to make tax-free payments to players, managers, staff and former employees in the shape of “loans” or discretionary bonuses from the Trust.
Murray took £6.3 million worth of net payments in EBTs while other major beneficiaries included Barry Ferguson (£2.5 million), Stefan Klos (£2 million), Dado Prso (£1.9 million), Christian Nerlinger (£1.8 million), Michael Ball (£1.4 million), Tore André Flo (£1.3 million), Ronald de Boer and Thomas Buffel (£1.2 million each), Claudio Caniggia and Pedro Mendes (£1 million each) and managers Alex McLeish (£1.7 million) and Dick Advocaat (£1.5 million).
Celtic believed then that the involvement of the aforementioned players, along with 46 others, in league and cup matches during that 11-year span should make all their results null and void, should it be proved that the tax avoidance schemes had been misused.
“If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
It adds: “The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Five Supreme Court judges decided unanimously on July 5 that EBT payments were liable for tax. Rangers had denied the existence of side letters to players guaranteeing their extra payments — most of them were performance-related — to Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the footballing authorities but they were uncovered during a police raid on Ibrox.
Murray confessed in court earlier this year that EBTs “gave us [Rangers] an opportunity to get players that we perhaps would not be able to afford [otherwise]”. When the Supreme Court verdict was announced, the SFA issued a statement which said they would do nothing, on legal advice.
The SPFL board — it includes Rangers’ Stewart Robertson — also asked the SFA more than six weeks ago to consent to an impartial probe into how the governing bodies dealt with Rangers’ financial meltdown. It too has been met with silence. "It too has been met with silence." Can just picture them sitting in a corner with their fingers in their ears chanting 'laalaalaa' over and over again hoping it will go away.
The feckers in charge need punted, pronto.
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littlegmbhoy
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7 Sep 2017, 03:40 PM
Post #10409
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- He Cometh
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:17 PM
- littlegmbhoy
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:15 PM
- He Cometh
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:05 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep Celtic still pressing SFA for inquiryLawwell letter from 2012 outlines stance Spoiler: click to toggle Celtic have not given up hope of the Scottish Football Association agreeing to a judicial inquiry which would examine fully the roles played by the game’s ruling bodies before, during and after the financial implosion of Rangers in 2012.
It is understood that, while the SFA have yet to respond to a call from the Ladbrokes Premiership champions for such a forensic investigation some two months ago, Celtic believe that more stringent rules, checks and balances ought to be in place in order to restore confidence in the SFA while simultaneously ensuring that Rangers or any other club are not allowed to run up such unsustainable debts in future.
The Times can also reveal that, in an letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan, the SFA’s chief executive, immediately prior to Rangers descending from administration into liquidation five years ago, the Celtic chief executive not only demanded a judicial review of the scandal which rocked the national sport but also insisted that title-stripping and the removal of national cup competitions won by the fallen Glasgow club between 1999 and 2010 should form part of the sanctions open to that panel.
During those years, Sir David Murray had employed tax avoidance policies: firstly, the Discounted Option Scheme, for which they admitted liability, and secondly, the Employee Benefit Trusts, for which they did not. The deployment of these complex plans allowed Rangers to make tax-free payments to players, managers, staff and former employees in the shape of “loans” or discretionary bonuses from the Trust.
Murray took £6.3 million worth of net payments in EBTs while other major beneficiaries included Barry Ferguson (£2.5 million), Stefan Klos (£2 million), Dado Prso (£1.9 million), Christian Nerlinger (£1.8 million), Michael Ball (£1.4 million), Tore André Flo (£1.3 million), Ronald de Boer and Thomas Buffel (£1.2 million each), Claudio Caniggia and Pedro Mendes (£1 million each) and managers Alex McLeish (£1.7 million) and Dick Advocaat (£1.5 million).
Celtic believed then that the involvement of the aforementioned players, along with 46 others, in league and cup matches during that 11-year span should make all their results null and void, should it be proved that the tax avoidance schemes had been misused.
“If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
It adds: “The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Five Supreme Court judges decided unanimously on July 5 that EBT payments were liable for tax. Rangers had denied the existence of side letters to players guaranteeing their extra payments — most of them were performance-related — to Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the footballing authorities but they were uncovered during a police raid on Ibrox.
Murray confessed in court earlier this year that EBTs “gave us [Rangers] an opportunity to get players that we perhaps would not be able to afford [otherwise]”. When the Supreme Court verdict was announced, the SFA issued a statement which said they would do nothing, on legal advice.
The SPFL board — it includes Rangers’ Stewart Robertson — also asked the SFA more than six weeks ago to consent to an impartial probe into how the governing bodies dealt with Rangers’ financial meltdown. It too has been met with silence.
This letter is from 2012????? Can he/the board not release something just now that is up to date in line with recent events??
I know It's been released to rank the pressure up and is the first step. Celtic put another request of the same nature in just 2 months ago. Did not know they sent a further letter 2 months ago.....
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thebigcup
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7 Sep 2017, 03:57 PM
Post #10410
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Someone will still manage to turn this into an anti Peter Lawell thread, but, but !
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Torquemada
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7 Sep 2017, 03:59 PM
Post #10411
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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The folgensie folgensie thread on this is something to behold -- rage and hatred and whataboutery to beat the band but, for possibly the first time, a discernible air of resignation and defeat, as if they know the centre cannot hold. I imagine if Celtic came out and said we did not want the titles but that they should be withheld, it might force the SPFL/SFA to throw in their hand.
The fact that Doncaster and McKenzie have already admitted the issue was on the agenda at the 5WA but withdrawn at the insistence of Green and McCoist -- who were representing a different club FFS! -- shows their stance is built on shifting sands.
A wee aside that the other clubs who lost out on trophies may want to claim them belatedly could add to the fun.
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justinjest
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7 Sep 2017, 04:02 PM
Post #10412
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- the-gaffer606
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:17 PM
- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:26 PM
- green_equals_silver
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:01 PM
Strip the titles, get it done. They'll be going for 45 by the end of this if they're lucky
it's oldco rangers who died in 2012 that we want the titles stripped from, not the tribute act - they are going for 1 and won't be getting that in the foreseeable future. With regard PL's running of Celtic, I reckon he has always looked at the bigger picture and was aware that Scottish football Does need some team out of ibrox - an SPFL without a rangers would struggle to attract sponsorship, tv deals etc. PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened. Now there is a rangers team back in the SPL, he can go for the jugular.
🤣🤣🤣 I'm no even sure where to begin with this, I do think you make a relevent point but you've bastardised it completely 😂 Peter Lawwell didn't "donate £1m of Celtic's SKY money to Setanta"... the SPL bought the rights of the hun games off the SFL and included them in the SKY/ESPN deal, (they just replaced hun SPL games) but the money didn't come out of Celtic's pocket, it came out of the collective SPL pot in 2012-13 then by the time 2013-14 kicked off the SPL and SFL merged meaning they didn't need to buy the rights again but prize money was restructured in order to get more funds into 2nd tier clubs who were sailing to close to wind. Scotland's champions did drop around £700,000 in prize money but that had nothing to do with TV money, it was about making more funds available for those clubs in the league that would become the Championship. The point I actually agree with you on is Lawwell would've seen the benefit of having a form of huns in the system for marketing purposes. my understanding, at the time, was that Celtic agreed to forego the moneys (I thought £1 million) in order that Setanta cover rangers journey, thereby keeping them in the media spotlight. I think Celtic and Pl could have refused to "donate" the money, but as I suggested, I believe PL was looking at the longer term and accepted that the SPL needed a rangers in some form in order to attract sponsorship / media interest.
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Joe the Baker
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7 Sep 2017, 04:10 PM
Post #10413
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It feels like yesterday... I wish it was tomorrow.
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- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 04:02 PM
- the-gaffer606
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:17 PM
- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:26 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened. Now there is a rangers team back in the SPL, he can go for the jugular.
🤣🤣🤣 I'm no even sure where to begin with this, I do think you make a relevent point but you've bastardised it completely 😂 Peter Lawwell didn't "donate £1m of Celtic's SKY money to Setanta"... the SPL bought the rights of the hun games off the SFL and included them in the SKY/ESPN deal, (they just replaced hun SPL games) but the money didn't come out of Celtic's pocket, it came out of the collective SPL pot in 2012-13 then by the time 2013-14 kicked off the SPL and SFL merged meaning they didn't need to buy the rights again but prize money was restructured in order to get more funds into 2nd tier clubs who were sailing to close to wind. Scotland's champions did drop around £700,000 in prize money but that had nothing to do with TV money, it was about making more funds available for those clubs in the league that would become the Championship. The point I actually agree with you on is Lawwell would've seen the benefit of having a form of huns in the system for marketing purposes.
my understanding, at the time, was that Celtic agreed to forego the moneys (I thought £1 million) in order that Setanta cover rangers journey, thereby keeping them in the media spotlight. I think Celtic and Pl could have refused to "donate" the money, but as I suggested, I believe PL was looking at the longer term and accepted that the SPL needed a rangers in some form in order to attract sponsorship / media interest. Setanta went under in 2009.
We've had ESPN and BT sports since then.
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SonOfBobo
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7 Sep 2017, 04:12 PM
Post #10414
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- Joe the Baker
- 7 Sep 2017, 04:10 PM
- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 04:02 PM
- the-gaffer606
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:17 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened. Now there is a rangers team back in the SPL, he can go for the jugular.
my understanding, at the time, was that Celtic agreed to forego the moneys (I thought £1 million) in order that Setanta cover rangers journey, thereby keeping them in the media spotlight. I think Celtic and Pl could have refused to "donate" the money, but as I suggested, I believe PL was looking at the longer term and accepted that the SPL needed a rangers in some form in order to attract sponsorship / media interest.
Setanta went under in 2009. We've had ESPN and BT sports since then. Sevtanta Tv
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SwavBhoy
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7 Sep 2017, 04:21 PM
Post #10415
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Perhaps this is the first of many letters and there are more to come?
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Grafenwalder
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7 Sep 2017, 04:39 PM
Post #10416
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I think the main reason for this leak is to inform the Celtic support and shareholders, that the club shares their very logical view that these trophies should not remain as 'won by Rangers' in the history books. There will be plenty fans thinking, if this is what they call fair competition, I don't think I'll bother paying for it from now on.
Both the SFA and SPFL have basically washed their hands of this and I'm not sure how it can progress now unless there is a significant groundswell of opinion to force them to consider their positions.
As far as I can see, the other clubs are pretty much out, as far as calling it what it is and demanding further action.
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sevilliano
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7 Sep 2017, 05:03 PM
Post #10417
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Retired and now a BT Sports pundit
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- Tenenbaum
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:35 PM
How is this letter supposed to relate to the Nimmo Smith whitewash? Nimmo Smith was appointed in Feb 2012, before Lawwell wrote this letter which is being reported as being sent 'just' prior to the Huns exiting administration and entering liquidation - so definitely post February 2012 but pre Halloween 2012. (Just re-read this and the Lawwell letter was allegedly sent on 25/05/2012 - nice touch, if it's true; but I've learned to doubt everything I read in the MSM.)
Is Lawwell calling for a different inquiry in this letter? Why is he calling for an independent judge-led inquiry in May, when LNS was appointed previously in February of that year, but didn't make his conclusions until 28th February 2013.
Am I going mad, or does this letter raise a lot more questions than it answers? The timing of letter is the issue - as you say the LNS could be construed as fitting the bill as to being what is being asked for and the msm and the rest want everything to stand as per the LNS - but if the letter is really 25/5 and post LNS enquiry apptment it looks to be preserving our position for a full scale war down the line
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screwtop
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7 Sep 2017, 05:35 PM
Post #10418
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- Torquemada
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:13 PM
Excellent development. So much for those who claimed, some as late as yesterday, that Celtic would do nothing and wanted it all put behind us. That was carefully planted.
My only surprise is how forcefully it was written even back then. It shows that the recent missive following the Supreme Court judgment was perfectly weighted. The axis of evil at Hampden know exactly Celtic's position. Their only hope is to make it an "Old Firm" dispute on which they can remain "impartial". Now that The Times has run with it, the other clubs will be forced to respond, I imagine, if not by the SMSM then by their fans. Let's see! I agree with you. Sometimes you wonder about those who seem to know feck all about what is going on.
I blame the schools myself.
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Dubz
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7 Sep 2017, 06:08 PM
Post #10419
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- Tenenbaum
- 7 Sep 2017, 03:35 PM
How is this letter supposed to relate to the Nimmo Smith whitewash? Nimmo Smith was appointed in Feb 2012, before Lawwell wrote this letter which is being reported as being sent 'just' prior to the Huns exiting administration and entering liquidation - so definitely post February 2012 but pre Halloween 2012. (Just re-read this and the Lawwell letter was allegedly sent on 25/05/2012 - nice touch, if it's true; but I've learned to doubt everything I read in the MSM.)
Is Lawwell calling for a different inquiry in this letter? Why is he calling for an independent judge-led inquiry in May, when LNS was appointed previously in February of that year, but didn't make his conclusions until 28th February 2013.
Am I going mad, or does this letter raise a lot more questions than it answers? Lawwell is calling on the SFA (LNS was SPL issue) to launch an independent inquiry on the back of new evidence revealed in the BBC programme. Looks like he wanted the terms of reference to include improperly registered players, dual contracts, misconduct and the conduct of individuals involved, past and present and disrepute charges. I think it's plainly obvious from the letter the Celtic Board knew very early on that LNS was going to be a whitewash. Lawwell even refers to it indirectly in the letter by stating that the LNS inquiry is still waiting on evidence and/or documentation.
Edited by Dubz, 7 Sep 2017, 06:10 PM.
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aldo
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7 Sep 2017, 06:26 PM
Post #10420
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And that's the way we like it...
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Not worth a mention on Scotland Today, but CPP's afforded a few minutes of his peculiar gibberish from today's presser...
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