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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
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Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,414,503 Views)
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Torquemada
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7 Sep 2017, 12:13 PM
Post #10381
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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Excellent development. So much for those who claimed, some as late as yesterday, that Celtic would do nothing and wanted it all put behind us. That was carefully planted.
My only surprise is how forcefully it was written even back then. It shows that the recent missive following the Supreme Court judgment was perfectly weighted. The axis of evil at Hampden know exactly Celtic's position. Their only hope is to make it an "Old Firm" dispute on which they can remain "impartial". Now that The Times has run with it, the other clubs will be forced to respond, I imagine, if not by the SMSM then by their fans. Let's see!
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justinjest
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7 Sep 2017, 12:26 PM
Post #10382
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- green_equals_silver
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:01 PM
Strip the titles, get it done. They'll be going for 45 by the end of this if they're lucky it's oldco rangers who died in 2012 that we want the titles stripped from, not the tribute act - they are going for 1 and won't be getting that in the foreseeable future.
With regard PL's running of Celtic, I reckon he has always looked at the bigger picture and was aware that Scottish football Does need some team out of ibrox - an SPFL without a rangers would struggle to attract sponsorship, tv deals etc. PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened. Now there is a rangers team back in the SPL, he can go for the jugular.
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aldo
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7 Sep 2017, 12:28 PM
Post #10383
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And that's the way we like it...
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- Torquemada
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:13 PM
Excellent development. So much for those who claimed, some as late as yesterday, that Celtic would do nothing and wanted it all put behind us. That was carefully planted.
My only surprise is how forcefully it was written even back then. It shows that the recent missive following the Supreme Court judgment was perfectly weighted. The axis of evil at Hampden know exactly Celtic's position. Their only hope is to make it an "Old Firm" dispute on which they can remain "impartial". Now that The Times has run with it, the other clubs will be forced to respond, I imagine, if not by the SMSM then by their fans. Let's see! My immediate impression was the letter had been composed by someone with the skills of Paul McBride. Focused and forceful, without resorting to denigrating the target, or issuing hollow threats.
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Luigi
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7 Sep 2017, 12:30 PM
Post #10384
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Everyone's Fantasy Football first pick
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Any follow up correspondence is what it would be good to see. I can't see the SFA, SPL not responding to letters of this sort so it would be good to get their stance on it.
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Dhogtanian
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7 Sep 2017, 12:36 PM
Post #10385
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Retired and now an out of work Setanta pundit looking for a job at ESPN or Sky. Or BEIN or BT Sport!
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- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:26 PM
PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened. What?
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Forza
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7 Sep 2017, 12:47 PM
Post #10386
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- Dhogtanian
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:36 PM
- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:26 PM
PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened.
What? You beat me to it!
In time for the 2013/14 season, the SPL and SFL merged to become the SPFL, which also brought in a new income distribution system. That became less weighted in favour of the teams finishing first and second in the Premiership, in favour of primarily clubs in the second tier (Championship), and there was a better trickle down for clubs in the third and fourth tiers. Sevco were in the third tier at this time.
This does not amount to Lawwell giving Setanta, who were defunct in the UK at this point, or any other broadcaster anything like £1m to 'keep a Rangers team in the media'.
Also, Lawwell would have had absolutely no say on Sevco getting a licence in the first place, which happened the year previously. That was something that the Five Way Agreement took care of.
Edited by Forza, 7 Sep 2017, 12:49 PM.
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fatboab
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7 Sep 2017, 12:50 PM
Post #10387
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Just before the Dawn
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- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:26 PM
PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened. Now there is a rangers team back in the SPL, he can go for the jugular. whit?????????????
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aldo
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7 Sep 2017, 12:51 PM
Post #10388
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And that's the way we like it...
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- Dhogtanian
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:36 PM
- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:26 PM
PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened.
What? Like that "I believe" caveat's gonnae excuse that pish he's just made up!
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Dubz
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7 Sep 2017, 12:52 PM
Post #10389
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- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:26 PM
- green_equals_silver
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:01 PM
Strip the titles, get it done. They'll be going for 45 by the end of this if they're lucky
it's oldco rangers who died in 2012 that we want the titles stripped from, not the tribute act - they are going for 1 and won't be getting that in the foreseeable future. With regard PL's running of Celtic, I reckon he has always looked at the bigger picture and was aware that Scottish football Does need some team out of ibrox - an SPFL without a rangers would struggle to attract sponsorship, tv deals etc. PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened. Now there is a rangers team back in the SPL, he can go for the jugular. Are you ok?
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Flawless
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7 Sep 2017, 01:03 PM
Post #10390
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- BardseyCelt
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:13 PM
- Luigi
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:12 PM
- videocelts
- 7 Sep 2017, 08:25 AM
Feck me that's a horrible website to visit Pop ups and windows everywhere. I'm at work so can't install adblocker or such like.
It's horrendous without adblocker. Spoiler: click to toggle - Quote:
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The Times has reproduced a letter sent by Celtic to the SFA in 2012 written shortly before Rangers went into liquidation.
It is claimed that Celtic requested a Judicial Review of regulation matters two months ago with the letter from 25 May 2012 outlining the concerns caused by dual contracts and various rule breaches.
The letter also questions the roles of a number of Ibrox officials- many of whom have waltzed back into power with jobs at Sevco.
The Times reports: “If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
“The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Since 2012 a number of similar decisions have defied logic with the SFA appearing to make up the rules as they go along.
After the July verdict from the Supreme Court the official message has been that there is no appetite for retrospective action and that it is time to move on ‘for the good of Scottish football’.
The appearance of this letter and the SFAs refusal to respond to the request for a Judicial Review suggests that the issue is still live.
Having been badly exposed in a twitter ticket row it’s unlikely that transparency campaigner Stewart Regan will comment on the 2012 letter.
It's still pish with it.
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Wanyerma
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7 Sep 2017, 01:41 PM
Post #10391
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- Torquemada
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:13 PM
Excellent development. So much for those who claimed, some as late as yesterday, that Celtic would do nothing and wanted it all put behind us. That was carefully planted.
My only surprise is how forcefully it was written even back then. It shows that the recent missive following the Supreme Court judgment was perfectly weighted. The axis of evil at Hampden know exactly Celtic's position. Their only hope is to make it an "Old Firm" dispute on which they can remain "impartial". Now that The Times has run with it, the other clubs will be forced to respond, I imagine, if not by the SMSM then by their fans. Let's see! Yes indeed, the letter proves myself (and others) were wrong in how seriously the board were taking this. My apologies to Lawell etc.
Onward to a satisfactory conclusion now I hope.
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Wee Ed KTF
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7 Sep 2017, 01:48 PM
Post #10392
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- Torquemada
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:13 PM
Excellent development. So much for those who claimed, some as late as yesterday, that Celtic would do nothing and wanted it all put behind us. That was carefully planted.
My only surprise is how forcefully it was written even back then. It shows that the recent missive following the Supreme Court judgment was perfectly weighted. The axis of evil at Hampden know exactly Celtic's position. Their only hope is to make it an "Old Firm" dispute on which they can remain "impartial". Now that The Times has run with it, the other clubs will be forced to respond, I imagine, if not by the SMSM then by their fans. Let's see! I am suitably apologetic.
However, I remain a cynical, cantankerous and suspicious old git
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Harry68
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7 Sep 2017, 01:48 PM
Post #10393
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Retired and now a BT Sports pundit
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- ticcy_paper
- 7 Sep 2017, 11:02 AM
- Wee Ed KTF
- 7 Sep 2017, 10:58 AM
- He Cometh
- 7 Sep 2017, 10:45 AM
This clearly reads to me that Peter Lawwell has had enough of their attempts to whitewash this and is taking the gloves off.
I suspect this is a leak from Lawwell. Ewing Grahame (The Times journalist) is, I believe, a freelance. He is a former tabloid hack. I interviewed Grahame many, many moons ago. He is, IIRC, a Celtic fan.
Hertz fan I think He's a Celtic supporter.
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He Cometh
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7 Sep 2017, 01:54 PM
Post #10394
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First name on the team-sheet
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Here is the letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan. It also confirms Celtic have been in contact with UEFA on this matter since 2012.
If you look back on this thread there are many who were completely wrong and sometimes out of order with false accusations of the club and Lawwell standing by and doing nothing.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJH03YCXgAEGShh.jpg
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OBK
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7 Sep 2017, 02:00 PM
Post #10395
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Everyone's Fantasy Football first pick
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- Torquemada
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:13 PM
Excellent development. So much for those who claimed, some as late as yesterday, that Celtic would do nothing and wanted it all put behind us. That was carefully planted.
My only surprise is how forcefully it was written even back then. It shows that the recent missive following the Supreme Court judgment was perfectly weighted. The axis of evil at Hampden know exactly Celtic's position. Their only hope is to make it an "Old Firm" dispute on which they can remain "impartial". Now that The Times has run with it, the other clubs will be forced to respond, I imagine, if not by the SMSM then by their fans. Let's see! Im one of them, havent really commented on it before on here but the day after I do this comes out. Ill just keep my mouth shut from now on
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aldo
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7 Sep 2017, 02:15 PM
Post #10396
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And that's the way we like it...
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- He Cometh
- 7 Sep 2017, 01:54 PM
Here is the letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan. It also confirms Celtic have been in contact with UEFA on this matter since 2012. If you look back on this thread there are many who were completely wrong and sometimes out of order with false accusations of the club and Lawwell standing by and doing nothing. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJH03YCXgAEGShh.jpg Where's that from?
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the-gaffer606
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7 Sep 2017, 02:17 PM
Post #10397
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- justinjest
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:26 PM
- green_equals_silver
- 7 Sep 2017, 12:01 PM
Strip the titles, get it done. They'll be going for 45 by the end of this if they're lucky
it's oldco rangers who died in 2012 that we want the titles stripped from, not the tribute act - they are going for 1 and won't be getting that in the foreseeable future. With regard PL's running of Celtic, I reckon he has always looked at the bigger picture and was aware that Scottish football Does need some team out of ibrox - an SPFL without a rangers would struggle to attract sponsorship, tv deals etc. PL donated £1 million of Celtic's Sky money to Setanta (I believe) in order to keep a rangers team in the media, when they started their journey - he reckoned the SPFL needed them back and needed to keep sponsors / tv companies onside until it happened. Now there is a rangers team back in the SPL, he can go for the jugular. 🤣🤣🤣
I'm no even sure where to begin with this, I do think you make a relevent point but you've bastardised it completely 😂
Peter Lawwell didn't "donate £1m of Celtic's SKY money to Setanta"... the SPL bought the rights of the hun games off the SFL and included them in the SKY/ESPN deal, (they just replaced hun SPL games) but the money didn't come out of Celtic's pocket, it came out of the collective SPL pot in 2012-13 then by the time 2013-14 kicked off the SPL and SFL merged meaning they didn't need to buy the rights again but prize money was restructured in order to get more funds into 2nd tier clubs who were sailing to close to wind.
Scotland's champions did drop around £700,000 in prize money but that had nothing to do with TV money, it was about making more funds available for those clubs in the league that would become the Championship.
The point I actually agree with you on is Lawwell would've seen the benefit of having a form of huns in the system for marketing purposes.
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Forza
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7 Sep 2017, 02:19 PM
Post #10398
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- aldo
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:15 PM
- He Cometh
- 7 Sep 2017, 01:54 PM
Here is the letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan. It also confirms Celtic have been in contact with UEFA on this matter since 2012. If you look back on this thread there are many who were completely wrong and sometimes out of order with false accusations of the club and Lawwell standing by and doing nothing. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJH03YCXgAEGShh.jpg
Where's that from? Looks like it is actually printed in the pages of today's Times article.
Interesting that it was copied to Infantino, then General Secretary of UEFA.
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He Cometh
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7 Sep 2017, 02:28 PM
Post #10399
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First name on the team-sheet
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- aldo
- 7 Sep 2017, 02:15 PM
- He Cometh
- 7 Sep 2017, 01:54 PM
Here is the letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan. It also confirms Celtic have been in contact with UEFA on this matter since 2012. If you look back on this thread there are many who were completely wrong and sometimes out of order with false accusations of the club and Lawwell standing by and doing nothing. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJH03YCXgAEGShh.jpg
Where's that from? The Times mate.
They have obviously been leaked the letter and it looks like the gloves are now off. The Scottish media puppets have rightly been bypassed.
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Gunner
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7 Sep 2017, 02:48 PM
Post #10400
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I'll play anywhere, as long as I get a game!
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Times article for anyone interested:
Celtic still pressing SFA for inquiry Lawwell letter from 2012 outlines stance
Spoiler: click to toggle Celtic have not given up hope of the Scottish Football Association agreeing to a judicial inquiry which would examine fully the roles played by the game’s ruling bodies before, during and after the financial implosion of Rangers in 2012.
It is understood that, while the SFA have yet to respond to a call from the Ladbrokes Premiership champions for such a forensic investigation some two months ago, Celtic believe that more stringent rules, checks and balances ought to be in place in order to restore confidence in the SFA while simultaneously ensuring that Rangers or any other club are not allowed to run up such unsustainable debts in future.
The Times can also reveal that, in an letter sent by Peter Lawwell to Stewart Regan, the SFA’s chief executive, immediately prior to Rangers descending from administration into liquidation five years ago, the Celtic chief executive not only demanded a judicial review of the scandal which rocked the national sport but also insisted that title-stripping and the removal of national cup competitions won by the fallen Glasgow club between 1999 and 2010 should form part of the sanctions open to that panel.
During those years, Sir David Murray had employed tax avoidance policies: firstly, the Discounted Option Scheme, for which they admitted liability, and secondly, the Employee Benefit Trusts, for which they did not. The deployment of these complex plans allowed Rangers to make tax-free payments to players, managers, staff and former employees in the shape of “loans” or discretionary bonuses from the Trust.
Murray took £6.3 million worth of net payments in EBTs while other major beneficiaries included Barry Ferguson (£2.5 million), Stefan Klos (£2 million), Dado Prso (£1.9 million), Christian Nerlinger (£1.8 million), Michael Ball (£1.4 million), Tore André Flo (£1.3 million), Ronald de Boer and Thomas Buffel (£1.2 million each), Claudio Caniggia and Pedro Mendes (£1 million each) and managers Alex McLeish (£1.7 million) and Dick Advocaat (£1.5 million).
Celtic believed then that the involvement of the aforementioned players, along with 46 others, in league and cup matches during that 11-year span should make all their results null and void, should it be proved that the tax avoidance schemes had been misused.
“If the allegations of ‘double contracts’ for players are true, and a breach of SPL and/or SFA rules is established, the eligibility of those players to have competed in domestic league and cup competitions will be called into question,” Lawwell wrote in his letter, sent on May 25, 2012, the 45th anniversary of Celtic’s European Cup triumph.
“In turn, the integrity of the football results achieved by using those players would by necessity also fall into question. Any wrongdoing then established would have to be subject to fair and proportionate sanctions, including retrospectively, if appropriate. However, at a higher level, in our opinion this whole affair is causing lasting damage to the reputation and integrity of Scottish football.”
It adds: “The interests of fairness and Scottish football now demand that the SFA act decisively. The initial inquiry should now be reconvened or a new independent panel led by a judge or senior lawyer should be formed to investigate and report upon the Rangers EBT issues and consider whether there has been any further breach of the Association’s rules, including those on disrepute.
“The roles of individuals (past and present) subject to the jurisdiction of the Association should also be examined. This should take place as quickly as possible, irrespective of the SPL’s own investigations.”
Five Supreme Court judges decided unanimously on July 5 that EBT payments were liable for tax. Rangers had denied the existence of side letters to players guaranteeing their extra payments — most of them were performance-related — to Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the footballing authorities but they were uncovered during a police raid on Ibrox.
Murray confessed in court earlier this year that EBTs “gave us [Rangers] an opportunity to get players that we perhaps would not be able to afford [otherwise]”. When the Supreme Court verdict was announced, the SFA issued a statement which said they would do nothing, on legal advice.
The SPFL board — it includes Rangers’ Stewart Robertson — also asked the SFA more than six weeks ago to consent to an impartial probe into how the governing bodies dealt with Rangers’ financial meltdown. It too has been met with silence.
Edited by Gunner, 7 Sep 2017, 02:49 PM.
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