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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,414,514 Views)
san meegs
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SaMule
8 Aug 2017, 03:07 PM
The huns won the league that day in 2003 when they were awarded a penalty deep into injury time*. We'd have won otherwise due to a better head to head record, so they really needed that last minute goal. They'd gone over half an hour without scoring a sixth, so if the Pars were really at it they could have given one away long before that. While I've got no problem believing that Tango & Sash were as happy as anyone in Ibrox at the result that day, it would be difficult to fix it to end that way without the collusion of at least the Pars player who gave away the penalty and maybe also the referee. I'm not sure who the player was (and I'm effed if I'm watching the highlights on YouTube just to find out :lol: ) but the ref was Stuart Dougal.

In short, if that game was rigged then it was rigged in an unnecessarily complex way, and as I wouldn't credit any of those involved with having the intelligence to plan all of it, I'm sceptical. I wouldn't be shocked if it were true, far from it - I've watched Scottish football long enough to know better than that. It just seems like a standard case of hun favouritism to me though, rather than anything more unusually devious.


*I always remember it as being 7 minutes into 4 minutes of added time :suspect:
I don't think we would have won it if they hadn't scored that pen unfortunately. Huns win it by a +1 better goal difference, thanks to that pen, but they'd have still won it on goals scored had they not got that.

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Broadly Equivalent Bhoy
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legal_man
8 Aug 2017, 03:26 PM
SaMule
8 Aug 2017, 03:07 PM
The huns won the league that day in 2003 when they were awarded a penalty deep into injury time*. We'd have won otherwise due to a better head to head record, so they really needed that last minute goal. They'd gone over half an hour without scoring a sixth, so if the Pars were really at it they could have given one away long before that. While I've got no problem believing that Tango & Sash were as happy as anyone in Ibrox at the result that day, it would be difficult to fix it to end that way without the collusion of at least the Pars player who gave away the penalty and maybe also the referee. I'm not sure who the player was (and I'm effed if I'm watching the highlights on YouTube just to find out :lol: ) but the ref was Stuart Dougal.

In short, if that game was rigged then it was rigged in an unnecessarily complex way, and as I wouldn't credit any of those involved with having the intelligence to plan all of it, I'm sceptical. I wouldn't be shocked if it were true, far from it - I've watched Scottish football long enough to know better than that. It just seems like a standard case of hun favouritism to me though, rather than anything more unusually devious.


*I always remember it as being 7 minutes into 4 minutes of added time :suspect:
Is this the case? I'm reasonably sure that in the event of teams being level on points in 2003 they were separated on goal difference, then goals scored, rather than on head-to-head record.

If it had stayed 5-1 to them and 4-0 to us the teams would have been level on goal difference, but they would have been ahead on goals scored. So their penalty put it beyond doubt, but it didn't win them the title in itself. (But happy to stand corrected.)

Anyway, as you say without the smoking gun it's difficult to prove. For example: we managed to put 4 goals past ex-Celtic keeper Gordon Marshall at Kilmarnock. How bothered was he?
As others have said he was persistently time wasting throughout the game.

Time wasting when you are 0-4 down in your last home game of the season :ffs:

Did he save a penalty or did Thommo not hit the target?

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san meegs
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Broadly Equivalent Bhoy
8 Aug 2017, 03:58 PM
legal_man
8 Aug 2017, 03:26 PM
SaMule
8 Aug 2017, 03:07 PM
The huns won the league that day in 2003 when they were awarded a penalty deep into injury time*. We'd have won otherwise due to a better head to head record, so they really needed that last minute goal. They'd gone over half an hour without scoring a sixth, so if the Pars were really at it they could have given one away long before that. While I've got no problem believing that Tango & Sash were as happy as anyone in Ibrox at the result that day, it would be difficult to fix it to end that way without the collusion of at least the Pars player who gave away the penalty and maybe also the referee. I'm not sure who the player was (and I'm effed if I'm watching the highlights on YouTube just to find out :lol: ) but the ref was Stuart Dougal.

In short, if that game was rigged then it was rigged in an unnecessarily complex way, and as I wouldn't credit any of those involved with having the intelligence to plan all of it, I'm sceptical. I wouldn't be shocked if it were true, far from it - I've watched Scottish football long enough to know better than that. It just seems like a standard case of hun favouritism to me though, rather than anything more unusually devious.


*I always remember it as being 7 minutes into 4 minutes of added time :suspect:
Is this the case? I'm reasonably sure that in the event of teams being level on points in 2003 they were separated on goal difference, then goals scored, rather than on head-to-head record.

If it had stayed 5-1 to them and 4-0 to us the teams would have been level on goal difference, but they would have been ahead on goals scored. So their penalty put it beyond doubt, but it didn't win them the title in itself. (But happy to stand corrected.)

Anyway, as you say without the smoking gun it's difficult to prove. For example: we managed to put 4 goals past ex-Celtic keeper Gordon Marshall at Kilmarnock. How bothered was he?
As others have said he was persistently time wasting throughout the game.

Time wasting when you are 0-4 down in your last home game of the season :ffs:

Did he save a penalty or did Thommo not hit the target?

Thompson skied it :(
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san meegs
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That league race had a few dodgy games tbh. The three penalties at Dens still amazes me to this day.
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Wanyerma
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Wailer
8 Aug 2017, 03:57 PM
CQN Magazine‏ @CQNMagazine 21h21 hours ago
More
For those following our 'Developing Story' conversation, as expected it developed further this afternoon and we should update on CQN later.
Well that gives them time to raise Ted Rodgers from the grave to write their update I guess!

Dusty Bin CSC
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murphio
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Jimbo Jones
8 Aug 2017, 03:22 PM
murphio
8 Aug 2017, 02:50 PM
For clarification; having dual ownership or direct/ indirect interest in more than one member club broke article 13 of SFA rules. This would tally with CQN's 'taped interviews' evidence from Calderwood which claimed Murray installed him at Dunfermline while still in charge at Rangers. Was Masterson a front man for Murray at another SPL club?
The Calderwood & Murray thing isn't new news though given the Off the Ball interview so there must be something else - maybe there is the evidence to say Murray was way too involved in Dunfermline. Whilst that is clearly in breach of rules, I'm not sure what they can do retrospectively other than ban Murray from being involved in football again?
Dunno mate; if it isn't match fixing then It's difficult to see what else could be in play in regards to Dunfermline that would be of interest to us other than Murray's influence there. I guess if there is anything in it we'll find out soon enough.




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SaMule
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Aye alright, I'll bow to the rest of you whose memories of that day aren't as clouded by bitterness and booze as mine clearly are.

Still think that penalty was dodgy though, and no carrot will ever convince me otherwise :arrr:
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Jimmy_Quinn's_Hattrick
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Calderwood's claims about Murray's involvement in his appointment at Dunfermline, and the claims of a sweetheart deal for Calderwood further down the line, should have been looked into in much more depth when it first emerged. With what we now know about the relationship between Murray and Masterton, and the former's proclivity for secret tax-free payment schemes to managers of other football clubs (Souness, for example), none of these people should be given the benefit of the doubt.

If nothing else, Calderwood being promised the Rangers job creates an obvious conflict of interest. This is perfectly in keeping with how the Charlotte Square mafia conducted business.
Edited by Jimmy_Quinn's_Hattrick, 8 Aug 2017, 04:16 PM.
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dazabhoy67
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Wailer
8 Aug 2017, 03:57 PM
CQN Magazineþ @CQNMagazine 21h21 hours ago
More
For those following our 'Developing Story' conversation, as expected it developed further this afternoon and we should update on CQN later.
:notmissingthis:
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Willie Wonka
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Wanyerma
8 Aug 2017, 04:00 PM
Wailer
8 Aug 2017, 03:57 PM
CQN Magazineþ @CQNMagazine 21h21 hours ago
More
For those following our 'Developing Story' conversation, as expected it developed further this afternoon and we should update on CQN later.
Well that gives them time to raise Ted Rodgers from the grave to write their update I guess!

Dusty Bin CSC
he was a hun :o
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andysayscfc
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dazabhoy67
8 Aug 2017, 04:15 PM
Wailer
8 Aug 2017, 03:57 PM
CQN Magazineþ @CQNMagazine 21h21 hours ago
More
For those following our 'Developing Story' conversation, as expected it developed further this afternoon and we should update on CQN later.
:notmissingthis:
This is the tweet that CQN sent out last night (before 7pm on Monday) that trailed last night's announcement - nothing new so far today.
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dazabhoy67
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andysayscfc
8 Aug 2017, 04:25 PM
dazabhoy67
8 Aug 2017, 04:15 PM
Wailer
8 Aug 2017, 03:57 PM
CQN Magazineþ @CQNMagazine 21h21 hours ago
More
For those following our 'Developing Story' conversation, as expected it developed further this afternoon and we should update on CQN later.
:notmissingthis:
This is the tweet that CQN sent out last night (before 7pm on Monday) that trailed last night's announcement - nothing new so far today.
:cry:
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NeilOMartin
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murphio
8 Aug 2017, 01:03 PM
sevilliano
8 Aug 2017, 12:15 PM
murphio
8 Aug 2017, 10:19 AM
A guy from CQN told RTC on Twitter his guesses at match fixing were 'completely wrong. Therefore I'm going to guess this is exactly what the boys have hinted it is; a 'jigsaw' dossier combining a lot of stuff that is already in the public domain re Calderwood, Murray, Masterson etc. I doubt a Zapruder tape has turned up but hey, I guess we can live in hope.
not being obtuse murphio but what else could there be here

calderwood was kidded on he was getting the job - and he was a big hun alongside his colleague

masterton was on board with dunfermilne and previously was the guy who signed off major funding of murray

must be more to it than that surely

and as for that 6th the pen jeez there should have been an enquiry as soon as that was given :brickwall:
I have no idea mate; I very much doubt some piece of smoking gun evidence has been uncovered 14 years later. What would that evidence even be? I guess we'll have to wait and see; and I certainly hope it's more than just a jigsaw puzzle of stuff already out there.
If it is just a re-hash of stuff already in the public domain, I'd rather they'd just left it alone. It takes focus off of the real scandal, which is already out in the open. Our efforts should be focussed on hammering away at that.

Still hope it's the nuclear option obvs :lol:
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Wanyerma
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Willie Wonka
8 Aug 2017, 04:21 PM
Wanyerma
8 Aug 2017, 04:00 PM
Wailer
8 Aug 2017, 03:57 PM
CQN Magazineþ @CQNMagazine 21h21 hours ago
More
For those following our 'Developing Story' conversation, as expected it developed further this afternoon and we should update on CQN later.
Well that gives them time to raise Ted Rodgers from the grave to write their update I guess!

Dusty Bin CSC
he was a hun :o
Dusty? :nono:
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FergusMcGrain
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SaMule
8 Aug 2017, 03:43 PM
legal_man
8 Aug 2017, 03:26 PM
SaMule
8 Aug 2017, 03:07 PM
The huns won the league that day in 2003 when they were awarded a penalty deep into injury time*. We'd have won otherwise due to a better head to head record, so they really needed that last minute goal. They'd gone over half an hour without scoring a sixth, so if the Pars were really at it they could have given one away long before that. While I've got no problem believing that Tango & Sash were as happy as anyone in Ibrox at the result that day, it would be difficult to fix it to end that way without the collusion of at least the Pars player who gave away the penalty and maybe also the referee. I'm not sure who the player was (and I'm effed if I'm watching the highlights on YouTube just to find out :lol: ) but the ref was Stuart Dougal.

In short, if that game was rigged then it was rigged in an unnecessarily complex way, and as I wouldn't credit any of those involved with having the intelligence to plan all of it, I'm sceptical. I wouldn't be shocked if it were true, far from it - I've watched Scottish football long enough to know better than that. It just seems like a standard case of hun favouritism to me though, rather than anything more unusually devious.


*I always remember it as being 7 minutes into 4 minutes of added time :suspect:
Is this the case? I'm reasonably sure that in the event of teams being level on points in 2003 they were separated on goal difference, then goals scored, rather than on head-to-head record.

If it had stayed 5-1 to them and 4-0 to us the teams would have been level on goal difference, but they would have been ahead on goals scored. So their penalty put it beyond doubt, but it didn't win them the title in itself. (But happy to stand corrected.)

Anyway, as you say without the smoking gun it's difficult to prove. For example: we managed to put 4 goals past ex-Celtic keeper Gordon Marshall at Kilmarnock. How bothered was he?
I'm happy to be corrected - I always remembered it as us being equal in goals scored as well, but as with the timing of the penalty that may well be the bitterness talking :lol:

NB Gordon Marshall never gave any impression of wanting Celtic to win when he played for us, so I'm not convinced that he'd be too bothered about us losing the league :ph43r:
Gordon ' Feckin' Marshall CELEBRATED at the end of that game, that's how bothered he was. He might have played for us once, but he was a dyed in the wool hun.
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legal_man
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SaMule
8 Aug 2017, 03:43 PM
legal_man
8 Aug 2017, 03:26 PM
SaMule
8 Aug 2017, 03:07 PM
The huns won the league that day in 2003 when they were awarded a penalty deep into injury time*. We'd have won otherwise due to a better head to head record, so they really needed that last minute goal. They'd gone over half an hour without scoring a sixth, so if the Pars were really at it they could have given one away long before that. While I've got no problem believing that Tango & Sash were as happy as anyone in Ibrox at the result that day, it would be difficult to fix it to end that way without the collusion of at least the Pars player who gave away the penalty and maybe also the referee. I'm not sure who the player was (and I'm effed if I'm watching the highlights on YouTube just to find out :lol: ) but the ref was Stuart Dougal.

In short, if that game was rigged then it was rigged in an unnecessarily complex way, and as I wouldn't credit any of those involved with having the intelligence to plan all of it, I'm sceptical. I wouldn't be shocked if it were true, far from it - I've watched Scottish football long enough to know better than that. It just seems like a standard case of hun favouritism to me though, rather than anything more unusually devious.


*I always remember it as being 7 minutes into 4 minutes of added time :suspect:
Is this the case? I'm reasonably sure that in the event of teams being level on points in 2003 they were separated on goal difference, then goals scored, rather than on head-to-head record.

If it had stayed 5-1 to them and 4-0 to us the teams would have been level on goal difference, but they would have been ahead on goals scored. So their penalty put it beyond doubt, but it didn't win them the title in itself. (But happy to stand corrected.)

Anyway, as you say without the smoking gun it's difficult to prove. For example: we managed to put 4 goals past ex-Celtic keeper Gordon Marshall at Kilmarnock. How bothered was he?
I'm happy to be corrected - I always remembered it as us being equal in goals scored as well, but as with the timing of the penalty that may well be the bitterness talking :lol:

NB Gordon Marshall never gave any impression of wanting Celtic to win when he played for us, so I'm not convinced that he'd be too bothered about us losing the league :ph43r:
:lol:

Everyone seems to remember him timewasting like feck that day, so fair enough. (And Marshall conceding goals would come as no surprise to those of us who watched him chucking them in for us.)

My overall contention still stands, though. A highly motivated Rangers team with Arteta, Arveladze, Mols, and De Boer beating a Dunfermline team with nothing to play for 6-1 isn't, in itself, that remarkable a result.
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LondonThomas
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legal_man
8 Aug 2017, 04:48 PM
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8 Aug 2017, 03:26 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I'm happy to be corrected - I always remembered it as us being equal in goals scored as well, but as with the timing of the penalty that may well be the bitterness talking :lol:

NB Gordon Marshall never gave any impression of wanting Celtic to win when he played for us, so I'm not convinced that he'd be too bothered about us losing the league :ph43r:
:lol:

Everyone seems to remember him timewasting like feck that day, so fair enough. (And Marshall conceding goals would come as no surprise to those of us who watched him chucking them in for us.)

My overall contention still stands, though. A highly motivated Rangers team with Arteta, Arveladze, Mols, and De Boer beating a Dunfermline team with nothing to play for 6-1 isn't, in itself, that remarkable a result.
...especially if the Dunfermline team aren't trying a leg.
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aldo
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It was said/alleged/made up by someone at the time that DAFC treated the team to a Mediterranean end of season jolly, departing the day after the game in question. The implication being that it would be another reason for them not to GAF about the game. Ring any bells?
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Wailer
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aldo
8 Aug 2017, 05:29 PM
It was said/alleged/made up by someone at the time that DAFC treated the team to a Mediterranean end of season jolly, departing the day after the game in question. The implication being that it would be another reason for them not to GAF about the game. Ring any bells?
Yeah I mind that.
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VerdeYBlanco
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aldo
8 Aug 2017, 05:29 PM
It was said/alleged/made up by someone at the time that DAFC treated the team to a Mediterranean end of season jolly, departing the day after the game in question. The implication being that it would be another reason for them not to GAF about the game. Ring any bells?
Yup. It was Malaga or La Manga or somewhere.
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