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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,414,587 Views)
SaMule
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ChiliPepper
1 Sep 2016, 12:16 PM
fatboab
1 Sep 2016, 12:14 PM
Ned Rise
1 Sep 2016, 10:30 AM


Rodgers took a chance in coming to Scottish football. He wanted someone in the middle of the park as they lynchpin to how he wants his team to play. That person never arrived. He now has to work a bit of magic with someone already on the books, but his job has become harder when he's about to face some of his toughest tests in football.

I understand we need a midfielder, and it would unquestionably improve us, but Rodgers standing in the game will not be determined by what he achieves or fails to achieve against Barcelona or Man City. He'll have known that the CL would throw up teams like this that would be favourites to skelp us. Neil Lennon achieved a miracle in beating Barcelona and look where it got him.
Next year will be the year we really start to enjoy Rodger's influence, and by this time next season, I expect us to be watching a radically different midfield.
That's assuming Rodgers will be here next season...
...which is a perfectly reasonable assumption to make.
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fatboab
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Just before the Dawn

ChiliPepper
1 Sep 2016, 12:16 PM
fatboab
1 Sep 2016, 12:14 PM
Ned Rise
1 Sep 2016, 10:30 AM


Rodgers took a chance in coming to Scottish football. He wanted someone in the middle of the park as they lynchpin to how he wants his team to play. That person never arrived. He now has to work a bit of magic with someone already on the books, but his job has become harder when he's about to face some of his toughest tests in football.

I understand we need a midfielder, and it would unquestionably improve us, but Rodgers standing in the game will not be determined by what he achieves or fails to achieve against Barcelona or Man City. He'll have known that the CL would throw up teams like this that would be favourites to skelp us. Neil Lennon achieved a miracle in beating Barcelona and look where it got him.
Next year will be the year we really start to enjoy Rodger's influence, and by this time next season, I expect us to be watching a radically different midfield.
That's assuming Rodgers will be here next season...
why would he not be? :ponder:
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Cumbernauldbhoy
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fatboab
1 Sep 2016, 12:26 PM
ChiliPepper
1 Sep 2016, 12:16 PM
fatboab
1 Sep 2016, 12:14 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
That's assuming Rodgers will be here next season...
why would he not be? :ponder:
Peter Lawwell scaring him away being the implication I think.

I understand folk being disappointed that we didn't get a midfielder in, I am one of those, but the tendency towards complete negativity online just gets a bit tiresome given that we're playing well, have a good manager and are in the Champions League.
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Ned Rise
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fatboab
1 Sep 2016, 12:14 PM
Ned Rise
1 Sep 2016, 10:30 AM


Rodgers took a chance in coming to Scottish football. He wanted someone in the middle of the park as they lynchpin to how he wants his team to play. That person never arrived. He now has to work a bit of magic with someone already on the books, but his job has become harder when he's about to face some of his toughest tests in football.

I understand we need a midfielder, and it would unquestionably improve us, but Rodgers standing in the game will not be determined by what he achieves or fails to achieve against Barcelona or Man City. He'll have known that the CL would throw up teams like this that would be favourites to skelp us. Neil Lennon achieved a miracle in beating Barcelona and look where it got him.
Next year will be the year we really start to enjoy Rodger's influence, and by this time next season, I expect us to be watching a radically different midfield.
I expect so too.

He's definitely shown a ruthless side to him, as Janko getting shipped out shows, and Gordon getting dropped. Quite right, no room for sentiment if you're going to be successful. I'm sure some folk thought Jim Leighton had been hard done by with Ferguson in the FA Cup final but he did what it took to win.

I suspect he'll be as determined when dealing with Peter Lawwell, so it would be good if those two were actually working in tandem rather than at loggerheads.

If Rodgers is happy with the club's efforts in the window, then all's well. The team are definitely better so far (assuming Gamboa and De Vries are are solid at least) and if Bitton can step up in the meantime then all well and good.

If he's not happy with the board's efforts, I think he'll be letting them know about it.
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Big Drew
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Cumbernauldbhoy
1 Sep 2016, 12:30 PM
fatboab
1 Sep 2016, 12:26 PM
ChiliPepper
1 Sep 2016, 12:16 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
why would he not be? :ponder:
Peter Lawwell scaring him away being the implication I think.

I understand folk being disappointed that we didn't get a midfielder in, I am one of those, but the tendency towards complete negativity online just gets a bit tiresome given that we're playing well, have a good manager and are in the Champions League.
This. Very tiresome. I blame Lawwell.
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brianlara67
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I think we are all agreed that we are better after this window, but it could and should have been better. The argument that was always put forward the past few years is that our risk averse Board wouldn't splash any cash because we didn't qualify for the CL (we won't go into they won't speculate to accumulate debate). Well this year we have and with more money than ever before and how have we done since we qualified last Tuesday? One player in and 2 out with a more than probable profit on those transactions if the fees involved are to be believed. If there was ever a time our risk averse Board were going to support our manager than this was it, especially as BR specifically identified what area of the team needed strengthening. And what happened? Not a lot really.

Next year's financials will be sensational and you will have to surgically remove the grin from SPLB's face especially when he gets his bonus.

I'm going to start a philosophical argument - namely should a football club be run at a profit? Or should every available penny be ploughed into the team after all expenses have been taken care of. Is stock piling cash you are never going to spend the right thing for a football club to do. Football is not like normal business. Normal businesses will aim to grow and grow and possibly take over rivals etc. A football club cannot do that. It can't take over a rival and double the stadium size. So what should be the business model for a football club. Our Board are very risk averse and I think they go too far in that direction. What's going to happen to the stock pile of cash we will get from this year's CL? Is it going to put away to be spent at some non specified point in future? Under this Board I think this is unlikely. So what happens to it? Say we qualify for the CL next year and the year after. If we operate a neutral transfer spend we will have banked almost £100M. What happens to it and indeed what should happen to it?
Edited by brianlara67, 1 Sep 2016, 12:45 PM.
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MBhoy1888
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Big Drew
1 Sep 2016, 12:38 PM
Cumbernauldbhoy
1 Sep 2016, 12:30 PM
fatboab
1 Sep 2016, 12:26 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Peter Lawwell scaring him away being the implication I think.

I understand folk being disappointed that we didn't get a midfielder in, I am one of those, but the tendency towards complete negativity online just gets a bit tiresome given that we're playing well, have a good manager and are in the Champions League.
This. Very tiresome. I blame Lawwell.
The Lawell factor has reached ridiculous levels on here, I'm not his biggest fan and I think there is a lot of fair criticism but there are now folk who simply find anything negative at all they can about the club only to then find a spurious way to make it the dastardly doing of PL.
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MBhoy1888
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brianlara67
1 Sep 2016, 12:43 PM
I think we are all agreed that we are better after this window, but it could and should have been better. The argument that was always put forward the past few years is that our risk averse Board wouldn't splash any cash because we didn't qualify for the CL (we won't go into they won't speculate to accumulate debate). Well this year we have and with more money than ever before and how have we done since we qualified last Tuesday? One player in and 2 out with a more than probable profit on those transactions if the fees involved are to be believed. If there was ever a time our risk averse Board were going to support our manager than this was it, especially as BR specifically identified what area of the team needed strengthening. And what happened? Not a lot really.

Next year's financials will be sensational and you will have to surgically remove the grin from SPLB's face especially when he gets his bonus.

I'm going to start a philosophical argument - namely should a football club be run at a profit? Or should every available penny be ploughed into the team after all expenses have been taken care of. Is stock piling cash you are never going to spend the right thing for a football club to do. Football is not like normal business. Normal businesses will aim to grow and grow and possibly take over rivals etc. A football club cannot do that. It can't take over a rival and double the stadium size. So what should be the business model for a football club. Our Board are very risk averse and I think they go too far in that direction. What's going to happen to the stock pile of cash we will get from this year's CL? Is it going to put away to be spent at some non specified point in future? Under this Board I think this is unlikely. So what happens to it? Say we qualify for the CL next year and the year after. If we operate a neutral transfer spend we will have banked almost £100M. What happens to it and indeed what should happen to it?
Where does this misconception arise from that Celtic are or have been 'stockpiling cash' ? If you look at the balance sheet it's obviously not the case.
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ChiliPepper
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Cumbernauldbhoy
1 Sep 2016, 12:30 PM
fatboab
1 Sep 2016, 12:26 PM
ChiliPepper
1 Sep 2016, 12:16 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
why would he not be? :ponder:
Peter Lawwell scaring him away being the implication I think.

I understand folk being disappointed that we didn't get a midfielder in, I am one of those, but the tendency towards complete negativity online just gets a bit tiresome given that we're playing well, have a good manager and are in the Champions League.
Not necessarily. I do think though that if any half decent EPL job comes up he'll go for it.
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fatboab
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Just before the Dawn

MBhoy1888
1 Sep 2016, 12:46 PM
brianlara67
1 Sep 2016, 12:43 PM
I think we are all agreed that we are better after this window, but it could and should have been better. The argument that was always put forward the past few years is that our risk averse Board wouldn't splash any cash because we didn't qualify for the CL (we won't go into they won't speculate to accumulate debate). Well this year we have and with more money than ever before and how have we done since we qualified last Tuesday? One player in and 2 out with a more than probable profit on those transactions if the fees involved are to be believed. If there was ever a time our risk averse Board were going to support our manager than this was it, especially as BR specifically identified what area of the team needed strengthening. And what happened? Not a lot really.

Next year's financials will be sensational and you will have to surgically remove the grin from SPLB's face especially when he gets his bonus.

I'm going to start a philosophical argument - namely should a football club be run at a profit? Or should every available penny be ploughed into the team after all expenses have been taken care of. Is stock piling cash you are never going to spend the right thing for a football club to do. Football is not like normal business. Normal businesses will aim to grow and grow and possibly take over rivals etc. A football club cannot do that. It can't take over a rival and double the stadium size. So what should be the business model for a football club. Our Board are very risk averse and I think they go too far in that direction. What's going to happen to the stock pile of cash we will get from this year's CL? Is it going to put away to be spent at some non specified point in future? Under this Board I think this is unlikely. So what happens to it? Say we qualify for the CL next year and the year after. If we operate a neutral transfer spend we will have banked almost £100M. What happens to it and indeed what should happen to it?
Where does this misconception arise from that Celtic are or have been 'stockpiling cash' ? If you look at the balance sheet it's obviously not the case.
one of the great misconceptions of our time. Stockpiling cash in a PLC. How does that work?
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Adam Smith 11
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hoops_2710
1 Sep 2016, 11:26 AM
Let's be realistic, what difference will a £5m player make to our CL hopes? We might only get slightly embarrassed instead of completely embarrassed? We will finish with - 4GD instead of - 7GD?
We have next to no chance of getting out of this group and spending multi millions isn't going to be a good business move.

I believe we are strong enough to achieve the treble. Why would the board needlessly splash cash to achieve domestic successful which is practically guaranteed?

Has anyone considered that we are keeping the dough for next summer to regroup from the losses of Toure and Roberts?

"Don't do bad deals"
What about being bedded in for next years qualifiers?

The main job of a board is to plan ahead.

The result of not planning ahead means scrambling about for players at the last minute.

Next year if we miss out on qualification because we try to integrate new players too late into the squad then the cycle may start again. Can't invest as we don't have CL money, hope I am wrong.

Let's be clear we have at least £15m more coming in than we needed/expected it is doing nothing at the moment ( we have credit facilities to bring this forward ) whereas it should be working as a football asset to ensure we win the league, do as well as possible in this years CL - anything extra is a bonus - and be in good shape for our six qualifying games next year.



Relatively we are far better off than expected in terms of the squad however we are even better off in terms of finance than expected.

If this is down to BR then fair enough there is only so much he can do, if there is a lack of willingness elsewhere to go the extra mile to stay in the CL next year then that is a worry.




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Cumbernauldbhoy
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ChiliPepper
1 Sep 2016, 12:50 PM
Cumbernauldbhoy
1 Sep 2016, 12:30 PM
fatboab
1 Sep 2016, 12:26 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Peter Lawwell scaring him away being the implication I think.

I understand folk being disappointed that we didn't get a midfielder in, I am one of those, but the tendency towards complete negativity online just gets a bit tiresome given that we're playing well, have a good manager and are in the Champions League.
Not necessarily. I do think though that if any half decent EPL job comes up he'll go for it.
He's already said that he had offers from EPL clubs but wants to do something different.
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PeterthePainter
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lisbonlion10
1 Sep 2016, 11:29 AM
We could have had a chance to get into the Europa League. Not now.
I think we will
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remy mcswain
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A 7/10 window

Short by a centre mid and striker and didn't clear enough dross out. Must be rectified in January.
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Corky Buczek
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FatherSpliffmas
1 Sep 2016, 11:33 AM
Central midfield is the glaring deficiency in our squad but it's also an expensive position to recruit for. Look at an average player like Jeff Hendrick going for £10m.

There was no point thrown money at it if we couldn't get the right player in. Especially given the flying start we've made - we're comfortably the best team in Scotland and the worst team in our CL group and no midfield signing was changing either of those situations.

We have cash to burn and can wait until January if we really need to. Yesterday doesn't take away from the brilliant business we've done on the whole this summer.
If you're market is the EPL then any position is expensive. Things is, there is a big wide world outside of England, much of which has players that are far less expensive.

A decent CM might make the difference between 3rd and 4th place in the CL and still being in Europe come January. The resources were there but we chose not to use them. Not spending money you have is as big a gamble as spending you money you don't have. And when we have chosen this route in the past decade, it hasn't turned it too well over the period has it ?
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Wailer
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remy mcswain
1 Sep 2016, 01:01 PM
A 7/10 window

Short by a centre mid and striker and didn't clear enough dross out. Must be rectified in January.
Going to be harder getting rid of the dross as they won't be playing much between now and then.
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Corky Buczek
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remy mcswain
1 Sep 2016, 01:01 PM
A 7/10 window

Short by a centre mid and striker and didn't clear enough dross out. Must be rectified in January.
Agree strongly with the centre midfield point.

Problem with the dross is that I dare say we can't force them out. Suspect zero first team action for the likes of GMS and Ambrose will force their hand in January.
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Adam Smith 11
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Corky Buczek
1 Sep 2016, 01:01 PM
FatherSpliffmas
1 Sep 2016, 11:33 AM
Central midfield is the glaring deficiency in our squad but it's also an expensive position to recruit for. Look at an average player like Jeff Hendrick going for £10m.

There was no point thrown money at it if we couldn't get the right player in. Especially given the flying start we've made - we're comfortably the best team in Scotland and the worst team in our CL group and no midfield signing was changing either of those situations.

We have cash to burn and can wait until January if we really need to. Yesterday doesn't take away from the brilliant business we've done on the whole this summer.
If you're market is the EPL then any position is expensive. Things is, there is a big wide world outside of England, much of which has players that are far less expensive.

A decent CM might make the difference between 3rd and 4th place in the CL and still being in Europe come January. The resources were there but we chose not to use them. Not spending money you have is as big a gamble as spending you money you don't have. And when we have chosen this route in the past decade, it hasn't turned it too well over the period has it ?
Just because we don't buy from the EPL doesn't mean their market valuations don't effect us.

Anyone we scout will be available to English teams and will be touted around. In order to secure them we have to out compete that market which has the same effect on prices. Technically it is the same thing.

The days of finding a rough diamond through scouting is gone in the connected world. We either pay the going rate or have a better system of adding value v coaching.
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Corky Buczek
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Adam Smith 11
1 Sep 2016, 01:21 PM
Corky Buczek
1 Sep 2016, 01:01 PM
FatherSpliffmas
1 Sep 2016, 11:33 AM
Central midfield is the glaring deficiency in our squad but it's also an expensive position to recruit for. Look at an average player like Jeff Hendrick going for £10m.

There was no point thrown money at it if we couldn't get the right player in. Especially given the flying start we've made - we're comfortably the best team in Scotland and the worst team in our CL group and no midfield signing was changing either of those situations.

We have cash to burn and can wait until January if we really need to. Yesterday doesn't take away from the brilliant business we've done on the whole this summer.
If you're market is the EPL then any position is expensive. Things is, there is a big wide world outside of England, much of which has players that are far less expensive.

A decent CM might make the difference between 3rd and 4th place in the CL and still being in Europe come January. The resources were there but we chose not to use them. Not spending money you have is as big a gamble as spending you money you don't have. And when we have chosen this route in the past decade, it hasn't turned it too well over the period has it ?
Just because we don't buy from the EPL doesn't mean their market valuations don't effect us.

Anyone we scout will be available to English teams and will be touted around. In order to secure them we have to out compete that market which has the same effect on prices. Technically it is the same thing.

The days of finding a rough diamond through scouting is gone in the connected world. We either pay the going rate or have a better system of adding value v coaching.
If your market is players in the EPL (the likes of Mccarthy & Wilshere), then economically it is a non starter for us. Agreed ?

Yes we cannot compete EPL clubs when it comes to fees and wages, but the EPL cannot hoover up every player in Europe either. I simply don't accept that there wasn't a central midfielder somewhere, available and in our price range (financially we had a great summer) who would have enhaced our squad.

Incidently in 2012 PL played hardball with Rosenborg over Markus Henriksen. They wanted £1.75M for a 20 year old Norwegian internationalist. PL wouldn't budge over £1.5M. Going into the last year of his contract with AZ67, last night saw him go to Hull for just under £5M.

PL's failure to do the deal in 2012 is utterly symptomatic of how he has run Celtic since 2008. I wonder if such a scenario happened last night.
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Greenock_Celt
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PeterthePainter
1 Sep 2016, 12:55 PM
lisbonlion10
1 Sep 2016, 11:29 AM
We could have had a chance to get into the Europa League. Not now.
I think we will
Monchengladbach are cracking side, we'd be doing well to get 3rd place even if we had made 1 or 2 more sgnings.

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