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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
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Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,415,001 Views)
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Big_Bobo_Balde
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31 Jul 2014, 09:57 AM
Post #481
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- quattrobhoy
- 31 Jul 2014, 09:48 AM
After Seville, MON said we'd "have to get used to life in the slow lane". I'm beginning to suspect that we could be stuck on the hard shoulder. The cars in the scrappy.
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Antoninho
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31 Jul 2014, 09:57 AM
Post #482
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They come out with the classic excuse time and again about which league we're currently festering in, when it comes to dodging the available money we have to spend on quality. But what makes us think they'd be any better at loosening the purse strings even if we did unlikely gain entry to the EPL?! They'd obviously splash out a bit more than they currently are, but the more money available to them, the more I fear they'd hold back. Unambitious cowards. They were bad enough with this mentality before, but the deidco scandal has made them worse!
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SaMule
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31 Jul 2014, 10:01 AM
Post #483
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- Zurawski 7
- 31 Jul 2014, 09:39 AM
"I think last night's result may have been on the cards. There has been no investment in the team."
"The last 6 months wasn't enjoyable. I started getting angry with the players which is not a good sign."
Neil Lennon speaking on @bbc5live
Interesting quotes, we knew about the lack of investment but it sounds like there were a few dressing room problems long before Deila came in. May also be linked in with Ledley & Samaras not getting the new deals they supposedly wanted (maybe Hooper too).
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paulfg42
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31 Jul 2014, 10:03 AM
Post #484
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Fiat justitia ruat caelum
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- Zurawski 7
- 31 Jul 2014, 09:39 AM
"I think last night's result may have been on the cards. There has been no investment in the team."
"The last 6 months wasn't enjoyable. I started getting angry with the players which is not a good sign."
Neil Lennon speaking on @bbc5live
Good for Neil speaking out. Must have pained him to see that result. Wonder if Lawwell will deign to respond?
Why would he be angry at the players - not listening, not good enough, complacent?
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The Green Lantern
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31 Jul 2014, 10:05 AM
Post #485
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The problem I have is that the Board is playing with a stacked deck. No matter what happens, the bank balance will be healthier this year than last. No matter what happens, the team will be poorer this year than last.
If we fail to qualify, we'll sell VVD and Forster because the revenue gap will have to be plugged. If we do qualify, VVD and Forster will still be sold; that money will be bundled in with the CL cash. Either way, we will continue to sell our best players and Lawell can still trumpet the fact that he's run the Club prudently.
I'm actually getting sick of the whole thing. We had a one-in-a-lifetime opportunity to dominate Scottish football - and kick on in Europe. Some reinvestment from the sale of players, plus using some of the CL cash, could have allowed us to really improve the quality of the team. Instead we've got a Celtic team that's barely worthy of the name.
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Tonus
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31 Jul 2014, 10:06 AM
Post #486
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When he says getting angry with the players, does he mean because they're shampooe and it was frustrating him. And that he knew he wasnt going to be allowed to bring in better.
It's worrying that we can sell Wanyama, Ledley, Hooper, McGeady a wee bit further back and Watt now yet we can only bring in a sick-note keeper and a championship reject.
There must be something going on in the background beyond 'Wheeey we're financially sound'.
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The Green Lantern
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31 Jul 2014, 10:07 AM
Post #487
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- paulfg42
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:03 AM
- Zurawski 7
- 31 Jul 2014, 09:39 AM
"I think last night's result may have been on the cards. There has been no investment in the team."
"The last 6 months wasn't enjoyable. I started getting angry with the players which is not a good sign."
Neil Lennon speaking on @bbc5live
Good for Neil speaking out. Must have pained him to see that result. Wonder if Lawwell will deign to respond? Why would he be angry at the players - not listening, not good enough, complacent? Maybe seeing the obvious lack of quality and their inability to play a more interesting brand of football. It would be frustrating to know that you're working with one hand tied behind your back.
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Smiley
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31 Jul 2014, 10:08 AM
Post #488
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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- quattrobhoy
- 31 Jul 2014, 09:48 AM
After Seville, MON said we'd "have to get used to life in the slow lane". I'm beginning to suspect that we could be stuck on the hard shoulder. That's the first time anyone's said that.
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Mackin
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31 Jul 2014, 10:09 AM
Post #489
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Is there a CQN blog yet telling us it will all be OK and Peter knows what hes doing?
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londontoglasgowCSC
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31 Jul 2014, 10:11 AM
Post #490
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They have more money to spend than they currently are which is sod all. I'm not asking us to go wild in the aisles just invest in the team properly. The board had no plan to continue on after the success of the first wave of players bought under Lennon. Should have been a plan to buy a slightly more expensive player with an even higher ceiling after selling Wanyama etc. Porto do it all the sodding time. They don't buy players like Hulk with what they find down the back of the sofa but when they develop and sell them it's 30m upwards they get for their 10m initial outlay.
Instead of that Lawwell decided to just buy some crappers with no likely return on investment at all at this stage, huge backwards step and he should be sacked because of it. He has no plan for the team which is unforgivable on his income. Can't justify it, time to go Peter.
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BeastieBhoy
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31 Jul 2014, 10:11 AM
Post #491
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Retired and now a BT Sports pundit
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- Mackin
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:09 AM
Is there a CQN blog yet telling us it will all be OK and Peter knows what hes doing?
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liger05
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31 Jul 2014, 10:11 AM
Post #492
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Signing Gordon really told us everything you need to know about those who run the club.
A keeper who hasn't played for 2 years that nobody else wanted but Celtic sign him simply because his free and cheap wages.
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dazabhoy67
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31 Jul 2014, 10:14 AM
Post #493
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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- The Green Lantern
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:05 AM
The problem I have is that the Board is playing with a stacked deck. No matter what happens, the bank balance will be healthier this year than last. No matter what happens, the team will be poorer this year than last.
If we fail to qualify, we'll sell VVD and Forster because the revenue gap will have to be plugged. If we do qualify, VVD and Forster will still be sold; that money will be bundled in with the CL cash. Either way, we will continue to sell our best players and Lawell can still trumpet the fact that he's run the Club prudently.
I'm actually getting sick of the whole thing. We had a one-in-a-lifetime opportunity to dominate Scottish football - and kick on in Europe. Some reinvestment from the sale of players, plus using some of the CL cash, could have allowed us to really improve the quality of the team. Instead we've got a Celtic team that's barely worthy of the name.
Bit ott
We maybe out of Europe at least close to being out now but thats not going to stop us dominating Scottish football for the next 10 years.
Even if the club sells Forster and VVD its not going to make a difference to us winning the league or not. Sevco will not be in a good shape when they do arrive at the top table. There will be another admin before that happens as well. We will most likley get to 6 or 7 before they are in a position to be taken seriously.
We just need to regroup, invest in our youth and bring in some decent young talent to replace the players being sold.
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Luxo
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31 Jul 2014, 10:20 AM
Post #494
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- londontoglasgowCSC
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:11 AM
They have more money to spend than they currently are which is sod all. I'm not asking us to go wild in the aisles just invest in the team properly. The board had no plan to continue on after the success of the first wave of players bought under Lennon. Should have been a plan to buy a slightly more expensive player with an even higher ceiling after selling Wanyama etc. Porto do it all the sodding time. They don't buy players like Hulk with what they find down the back of the sofa but when they develop and sell them it's 30m upwards they get for their 10m initial outlay.
Instead of that Lawwell decided to just buy some crappers with no likely return on investment at all at this stage, huge backwards step and he should be sacked because of it. He has no plan for the team which is unforgivable on his income. Can't justify it, time to go Peter. absolutely. For our model to work properly, we have to keep improving. We have done the opposite.
Porto are about to sell Mangala for about EUR 35M. They paid EUR 6M for him from Standard Liege. Serious outlay in order to generate a real class player.
A 6M purchase however, would screw up our wage structure We now have a team on relatively low salaries, and there appears to be no desire to bring in someone who is markedly better (and therefore more costly) than what we have already.
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idyllwild
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31 Jul 2014, 10:21 AM
Post #495
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- dazabhoy67
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:14 AM
- The Green Lantern
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:05 AM
The problem I have is that the Board is playing with a stacked deck. No matter what happens, the bank balance will be healthier this year than last. No matter what happens, the team will be poorer this year than last.
If we fail to qualify, we'll sell VVD and Forster because the revenue gap will have to be plugged. If we do qualify, VVD and Forster will still be sold; that money will be bundled in with the CL cash. Either way, we will continue to sell our best players and Lawell can still trumpet the fact that he's run the Club prudently.
I'm actually getting sick of the whole thing. We had a one-in-a-lifetime opportunity to dominate Scottish football - and kick on in Europe. Some reinvestment from the sale of players, plus using some of the CL cash, could have allowed us to really improve the quality of the team. Instead we've got a Celtic team that's barely worthy of the name.
Bit ott We maybe out of Europe at least close to being out now but thats not going to stop us dominating Scottish football for the next 10 years. Even if the club sells Forster and VVD its not going to make a difference to us winning the league or not. Sevco will not be in a good shape when they do arrive at the top table. There will be another admin before that happens as well. We will most likley get to 6 or 7 before they are in a position to be taken seriously. We just need to regroup, invest in our youth and bring in some decent young talent to replace the players being sold. Honestly, WGAF about the huns? We may "dominate Scottish football for the next 10 years" (bring back the effin rolleyes smiley!), but that's hardly a reflection the quality of the team or the club.
Since Larsson and Sutton left, we've bought cheaper and cheaper replacements, to the point that we find ourselves bringing on Leigh Griffiths to try and save our season. Leigh effin Griffiths.
And when he inevitably gets punted, what quality of player are we going to replace him with?
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liger05
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31 Jul 2014, 10:23 AM
Post #496
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Can this club seriously not spend £3 - £5 mil on a player who could then potentially go for 3 x that amount?
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Tonus
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31 Jul 2014, 10:23 AM
Post #497
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- idyllwild
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:21 AM
- dazabhoy67
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:14 AM
- The Green Lantern
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:05 AM
The problem I have is that the Board is playing with a stacked deck. No matter what happens, the bank balance will be healthier this year than last. No matter what happens, the team will be poorer this year than last.
If we fail to qualify, we'll sell VVD and Forster because the revenue gap will have to be plugged. If we do qualify, VVD and Forster will still be sold; that money will be bundled in with the CL cash. Either way, we will continue to sell our best players and Lawell can still trumpet the fact that he's run the Club prudently.
I'm actually getting sick of the whole thing. We had a one-in-a-lifetime opportunity to dominate Scottish football - and kick on in Europe. Some reinvestment from the sale of players, plus using some of the CL cash, could have allowed us to really improve the quality of the team. Instead we've got a Celtic team that's barely worthy of the name.
Bit ott We maybe out of Europe at least close to being out now but thats not going to stop us dominating Scottish football for the next 10 years. Even if the club sells Forster and VVD its not going to make a difference to us winning the league or not. Sevco will not be in a good shape when they do arrive at the top table. There will be another admin before that happens as well. We will most likley get to 6 or 7 before they are in a position to be taken seriously. We just need to regroup, invest in our youth and bring in some decent young talent to replace the players being sold.
Honestly, WGAF about the huns? We may "dominate Scottish football for the next 10 years" (bring back the effin rolleyes smiley!), but that's hardly a reflection the quality of the team or the club. Since Larsson and Sutton left, we've bought cheaper and cheaper replacements, to the point that we find ourselves bringing on Leigh Griffiths to try and save our season. Leigh effin Griffiths. And when he inevitably gets punted, what quality of player are we going to replace him with? Who's currently playing up top for Hibs?
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The Green Lantern
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31 Jul 2014, 10:26 AM
Post #498
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- idyllwild
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:21 AM
- dazabhoy67
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:14 AM
- The Green Lantern
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:05 AM
The problem I have is that the Board is playing with a stacked deck. No matter what happens, the bank balance will be healthier this year than last. No matter what happens, the team will be poorer this year than last.
If we fail to qualify, we'll sell VVD and Forster because the revenue gap will have to be plugged. If we do qualify, VVD and Forster will still be sold; that money will be bundled in with the CL cash. Either way, we will continue to sell our best players and Lawell can still trumpet the fact that he's run the Club prudently.
I'm actually getting sick of the whole thing. We had a one-in-a-lifetime opportunity to dominate Scottish football - and kick on in Europe. Some reinvestment from the sale of players, plus using some of the CL cash, could have allowed us to really improve the quality of the team. Instead we've got a Celtic team that's barely worthy of the name.
Bit ott We maybe out of Europe at least close to being out now but thats not going to stop us dominating Scottish football for the next 10 years. Even if the club sells Forster and VVD its not going to make a difference to us winning the league or not. Sevco will not be in a good shape when they do arrive at the top table. There will be another admin before that happens as well. We will most likley get to 6 or 7 before they are in a position to be taken seriously. We just need to regroup, invest in our youth and bring in some decent young talent to replace the players being sold.
Honestly, WGAF about the huns? We may "dominate Scottish football for the next 10 years" (bring back the effin rolleyes smiley!), but that's hardly a reflection the quality of the team or the club. Since Larsson and Sutton left, we've bought cheaper and cheaper replacements, to the point that we find ourselves bringing on Leigh Griffiths to try and save our season. Leigh effin Griffiths. And when he inevitably gets punted, what quality of player are we going to replace him with? Exactly. This has been an ongoing process for about a decade. We replaced Larsson with Henri Camara, ffs.
Even the players that Strachan had are miles better than what we have now. JVOH, Naka, McDonald, Donati, Jarosik and even Tommy Gravesen would walk into this current team. The comparison to MON's team is even more stark: we've went from Lambert, Lennon, Petrov, Thompson and Lubo to Charlie Mulgrew and a guy who can't get a game for Cardiff.
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zombieslayer35
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31 Jul 2014, 10:31 AM
Post #499
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- liger05
- 31 Jul 2014, 10:23 AM
Can this club seriously not spend £3 - £5 mil on a player who could then potentially go for 3 x that amount? I would think that we could if we wanted. Trouble is the board don't want to and are happy shopping in the bargain basement.
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FatherSpliffmas
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31 Jul 2014, 10:31 AM
Post #500
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Everyone's Fantasy Football first pick
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Scotsman article from September 2003 http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/latest/o-neill-left-in-the-slow-lane-1-1294386
Quite depressing reading 11 years on.
Spoiler: click to toggle CELTIC face the French champions on Tuesday and the Scottish champions on Saturday, but neither will be quite so unsettling as their opponents in between. If the club’s board were in any doubt as to the hostility that they are likely to encounter in Friday’s annual general meeting, they have been reminded of it by none other than their manager, Martin O’Neill.
In another swipe at his paymasters’ parsimony, on this occasion delivered with devilish timing, the man the supporters believe can do no wrong has all but given them a rallying cry ahead of this week’s date with the directors. The glamour, he warns, that they have been privileged enough to enjoy these past few years will disappear with the team’s ageing players if money is not found to replace them.
Brian Quinn, the Celtic chairman, started this latest spat by claiming that, given the club’s financial plight, and the continuing economic slump in which football finds itself, it would be "highly irresponsible" of him and his colleagues to sanction significant spending in the transfer market. It could, he said, be another two years before O’Neill was permitted to make a high-profile signing.
The manager, of course, has not taken kindly to that suggestion. Lyon wouldn’t even be visiting Celtic Park on Tuesday had O’Neill not spent several million pounds transforming the Parkhead club into a force at home and abroad. To cease the practice that has enabled them to come this far in the first place would bring an end to nights like these. "If that is the case, then somewhere along the line, we will have to get used to life in the slow lane," he says.
Quinn, who would not pretend to relish a popularity contest with his manager, at least has the accountants to defend him against claims that he lacks ambition. PricewaterhouseCooper, the financial analysts who routinely criticise the way in which Scottish clubs are run, have praised the Celtic chairman for making a stand. The club, after all, have lost more than 20m in the past three years, despite last season’s run to the UEFA Cup final, and have a debt totalling 17.8m.
O’Neill, on the other hand, is entitled to point out that their debt is less than a third of that which saddles Rangers. The wage bill, which has risen by 80% since he took over in 2000, is still one of the few to remain within the recommended percentage of turnover. Why, then, the extreme solution to a problem that is much worse elsewhere? The Celtic manager cannot understand why there should be no room to manoeuvre new players through future transfer windows.
"My own view is that we are not in any unmanageable debt, and I would hope that some things might improve. Thankfully, we have not budgeted for any money in Europe. Anything we get from the Champions League will be a bonus, and we are there until at least Christmas time. You are always thinking that there could be something in the kitty to do things. Maybe that’s what I am hoping for."
Celtic, like any self-respecting football team, must reinvent themselves merely to maintain standards. A number of contracts are due to expire at the end of this season, among them those with the signatures of Johan Mjallby and Henrik Larsson on them. Some players, such as Paul Lambert, have no time left. Others, such as Stilian Petrov, have so much that they would rather not spend it all in Glasgow.
"At some stage or another in the next couple of years, all the big earners will either leave because their contracts are finished, or leave because of some offer that both they and the club find acceptable," adds O’Neill. "If you have to start replacing them with players on much less money, the club will still be demanding that they are every bit as good, if not better, than those they replaced. That’s where the problem lies.
"We have a couple of decent up-and-coming players who I’m hoping will be the lifeblood of the club, like [Shaun] Maloney, [Liam] Miller, [Craig] Beattie, [Ross] Wallace and [John] Kennedy, but they are still unproven. If you put all of those young players into the team at the same time, without some really decent players alongside them, you will lose. Not because they are not fine players, but because they need help until they are absolutely ready. If you don’t replace some of the really fine players we have at this club with another set of fine players, you will have to accept the consequences."
This is fighting talk by a man who has come to appreciate that he speaks from a position of power. The more the board congratulate themselves on his appointment, remind the fans how lucky they are to have him, and portray him as an intelligent man, sensible and easy to deal with behind closed doors, the more difficult it becomes to dispute any of his opinions. Strengthened by every story linking him with a move to the Premiership, O’Neill is free to flex his muscles as and when he chooses. He may also see in new executive director Peter Lawwell a man he can do business with.
O’Neill insists he is not asking for much, even just a splash of colour to freshen things up. While Rangers brought in six new players before last month’s closure of the transfer window, Celtic secured only Michael Gray on loan from Sunderland. They haven’t spent money on a player since Magnus Hedman and Ulrik Laursen joined the club over a year ago.
Dani’s trial at Celtic Park has proved to be a waste of time, and Ivan De la Pena has yet to be offered anything. O’Neill tried to sign Emerson from Atletico Madrid, but the midfielder ended up at Ibrox. "I thought that would be worth pursuing. I even got to speak to him on the phone, that type of thing. Whether it was already a done deal with Rangers is immaterial. There was a certain area where I could go no further."
Rangers are not the only club invigorated by new blood. All three of Celtic’s rivals in Group A of the Champions League have added to their squad. Lyon signed four new players in the summer, the most notable, strikers Giovane Elber and Florent Malouda, costing 3m each. Anderlecht also added four, and Bayern Munich topped the lot with their 13m purchase of Roy Makaay.
O’Neill recalls the coaches forum he attended in Nyon earlier this month, when he met Vfb Stuttgart’s Felix Magath and Porto’s Jose Mourinho, both of whom he locked horns with in the UEFA Cup last season. He was taken aback, particularly given the youthful resources at Magath’s disposal, by the extent to which both had tinkered with successful squads. It made him think about the implications of Celtic’s inertia.
"I think we must be the only team who have not changed personnel for one reason or another. I would have liked to have been able to do something, even if it was only to freshen things up. There is always a danger of stagnation. You are concerned that players will go into a bit of a comfort zone. They don’t see anyone arriving so they don’t find themselves under any pressure. It means that you have to create pressure from within.
"Young Miller has come in and done a great job, but when there is pressure from without, people think, ‘oh what’s happening here?’ That element of fear is important."
O’Neill recalls similar apprehension when, as a player with Notts Forest, he wondered what was meant by the signing of Trevor Francis. It was only later that he was objective enough to realise how the transfer, the first in Britain to break the million-pound barrier, had stimulated the club, the players and their supporters.
It is an indictment not so much of Celtic as the whole of Scottish football, and indeed beyond, that neither half of the Old Firm can afford to splash out even a fraction of that which was spent on Francis 24 long years ago. Dundee, for all their questionable economics, have appeared to be more ambitious than either of them. It is as well for the Glasgow clubs, weighed down as they are by financial restraints, that they have the Champions League to lift them. But for how long?
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