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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,415,002 Views)
Klepton
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Considering retirement
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Silent Witness
31 Jul 2014, 05:32 AM
Whilst it is tempting to focus the blame on individuals or a group for failures, I find myself in a minority that wonders what it is that the board is doing so wrong ? I think that they are obliged to operate under business principles, and even operating a football business is not that challenging compared with other business entities.

The charge that they do not invest or spend money is simply untrue. They do, but if the money invested last season did not yield value for money, then that is a failing of the footballing operation
Signings are controlled by Peter Lawwell. That's why the poor quality of the signings is Lawwell's fault (and by extension the board's).
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QualityStreet70
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stevie w f hegel
31 Jul 2014, 03:53 AM
As for your mention of the Golden Rule, by which I assume you mean a unsystematic version of the Kantian categorical imperative.
There is nothing more tedious than having to explain a joke, but since you seem a wee bit lost with this stuff... Have yourself a close look and you'll see that I added one, two and three asterisks to three elements within my post. Now have a really close look at the end of the post. Those asterisks reappear--along with the true meanings of the elements to which they were appended!

As you may have spotted, that Lawwell-esque business motto has "***" tagged onto the end of it, suggesting that, per standard format, some related addendum will appear later on. Indeed it does--I thought it was pretty clear that "the Golden Rule" was a direct reference to the fake business motto, not a completely random swerve into old-timey German philosophy.

Immanuel Kant... post industrial capitalism (sans hyphen!)... Fordist production--heady stuff for a football message board. When you mentioned "the spectacle" there, I was sure that we'd be treated to an equally obtuse riff about Debord, the Situationist International etc.. Alas, no. So maybe you're not just an insecure uni student at the wind-up after all.

I just noticed a post that said Lawwell/the board had "stabilised Celtic financially to the detriment of the team." Then I saw your follow-up, which asks, "the team in relation to who[m]?" Wind up? Never! But I have seen them given, Brian...

Maybe you could give us all a much-need laugh and cram an erudite Brian Cant reference into your next post. Cant. As opposed to Kant, that is.
Edited by QualityStreet70, 31 Jul 2014, 05:57 AM.
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stevie w f hegel
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QualityStreet70
31 Jul 2014, 05:56 AM
stevie w f hegel
31 Jul 2014, 03:53 AM
As for your mention of the Golden Rule, by which I assume you mean a unsystematic version of the Kantian categorical imperative.
There is nothing more tedious than having to explain a joke, but since you seem a wee bit lost with this stuff... Have yourself a close look and you'll see that I added one, two and three asterisks to three elements within my post. Now have a really close look at the end of the post. Those asterisks reappear--along with the true meanings of the elements to which they were appended!

As you may have spotted, that Lawwell-esque business motto has "***" tagged onto the end of it, suggesting that, per standard format, some related addendum will appear later on. Indeed it does--I thought it was pretty clear that "the Golden Rule" was a direct reference to the fake business motto, not a completely random swerve into old-timey German philosophy.

Immanuel Kant... post industrial capitalism (sans hyphen!)... Fordist production--heady stuff for a football message board. When you mentioned "the spectacle" there, I was sure that we'd be treated to an equally obtuse riff about Debord, the Situationist International etc.. Alas, no. So maybe you're not just an insecure uni student at the wind-up after all.

I just noticed a post that said Lawwell/the board had "stabilised Celtic financially to the detriment of the team." Then I saw your follow-up, which asks, "the team in relation to who[m]?" Wind up? Never! But I have seen them given, Brian...

Maybe you could give us all a much-need laugh and cram an erudite Brian Cant reference into your next post. Cant. As opposed to Kant, that is.
:lol:

I'll formulate an equally pithy response after some thought.
I was mainly writing grabbled pish, but its a common problem.
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QualityStreet70
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And a jolly good night to you, sir. Here's hoping things look a tad brighter the morra.

(Note to self: avoid the newsagent's.)

:i_say:

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Zurawski 7
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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Wee Ed KTF
31 Jul 2014, 01:49 AM
Mubo Loravcik
31 Jul 2014, 01:23 AM
We're not been mismanaged worse than the early 90s, that's impossible unless we are liquidated one day.

In many ways the situation is more reprehensible because we do have a fully qualified and competent board on the financial aspect, but the footballing department has been downsized beyond any level of acceptability. We will win 4IAR this season, this should not be a season of despair.

But to have only signed a freebie 3rd choice injury-prone goalie and a Cardiff reject as of 31st July? Pathetic. Perhaps if we're lucky, we'll buy Stevie May and James McFadden on a deadline day double-scoop as Forster and Van Dijk check in for medicals at St Mary's.

Commence the ultra apathy.
Too many saying four in a row is a certainty for my liking, especially given the incompetence of the Board, and tonight Ronny Deila and the players.

Add to the ingredients of potential disaster the almost certain sale of Fraser Forster and Virgil Van Dyke (maybe others), their replacements being Craig Gordon and some injury-prone, hairy-arsed non-entity from a Scandinavian backwater.

A decent and well organised SPFL team, most likely Aberdeen, could give us a run for our money.

IIRC, we needed Robbie Keane to help rescue 2nd place a few years ago?
no. we finished 18pts clear of 3rd. you are being silly now
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Marado
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I'll give you a war you won't believe.
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We'll be playing to crowds of 30000 regularly this season. Let's see what the response of the board is - my gut feeling is further downsizing and cost reductions will be their option.
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timtastic
Club Captain
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Marado
31 Jul 2014, 07:12 AM
We'll be playing to crowds of 30000 regularly this season. Let's see what the response of the board is - my gut feeling is further downsizing and cost reductions will be their option.
They'll do well to downsize on most of the current playing staff.
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josephledley
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Anybody still sticking up for the board needs to have a look at themselves.

The club has become a joke and laughing stock to anyone that doesn't have a Celtic connection. We've effed about so much that it will take a fortune for us to establish some credibility again
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paulfg42
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Fiat justitia ruat caelum
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I was depressed enough but reading some of the pseudo intellectual pish on here ...
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SaMule
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NSFW
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Silent Witness
31 Jul 2014, 05:32 AM
Whilst it is tempting to focus the blame on individuals or a group for failures, I find myself in a minority that wonders what it is that the board is doing so wrong ? I think that they are obliged to operate under business principles, and even operating a football business is not that challenging compared with other business entities.

The charge that they do not invest or spend money is simply untrue. They do, but if the money invested last season did not yield value for money, then that is a failing of the footballing operation (and regarding, the buy low, sell high policy, it was only valid for some, not all of our signings). The screams for greater investment stem from the relatively narrow horizon's of British football culture. Most of the EPL clubs are subsidy junkies, while aims of an average SPL club are modest to say the least. I would also ask how the investment strategies of the other CL qualifying clubs compare with ours. Given the level of investment in the current team, if anything, we are entitled ask why we are not getting better value for that ? This does not suggest a board that is failing. Rather, it suggests that our whole footballing operation is lacking in professionalism, compared even to smaller clubs in Europe.
That's pretty much how I see it too. They do spend in a way that's commensurate with our income, but they have an unfortunate tendency to spend it on players (and occasionally managers) that aren't very good.

I'm happy for the overall strategy to stay the same, but it's surely time to change some of the personnel involved in directing that strategy as the returns are diminishing year on year.
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fatboab
30 Jul 2014, 10:12 PM
Mr Lawwell, Mr Bankier, you reap what you sow. The downsizing comes home to roost.
I thought you had high hopes for this guy Bankier
What do you think has happened
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remy mcswain
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Big in Canada
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Estoril
31 Jul 2014, 08:54 AM
fatboab
30 Jul 2014, 10:12 PM
Mr Lawwell, Mr Bankier, you reap what you sow. The downsizing comes home to roost.
I thought you had high hopes for this guy Bankier
What do you think has happened
Bankier is a businessman who knows eff all about football.
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KTP
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How about no?
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remy mcswain
31 Jul 2014, 08:58 AM
Estoril
31 Jul 2014, 08:54 AM
fatboab
30 Jul 2014, 10:12 PM
Mr Lawwell, Mr Bankier, you reap what you sow. The downsizing comes home to roost.
I thought you had high hopes for this guy Bankier
What do you think has happened
Bankier is a businessman who knows eff all about football.
and thats the problem. on paper we are one of the best ran clubs. on the field we are getting worse as time goes on.
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faither
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This is the danger with our existing policy of buy cheap and sell. When we do get someone above the normal cut you only have him for one or two seasons at max. Therefore no opportunity to maximise potential to build a strong team for even limited success in the champions league.

Sadly it is now clear that we will probably not make that final break away in terms of class from Sevco. In the short term and I do mean for years we will be streets ahead but with maybe a some investment, some risk strategy built into the plan, we could have been totally out of sight in terms of stature on the park.

I really beieve that this season will be critical in relation to income at the club. The Europa League is a must, not because of the cash, but for keeping interest in the game to ensure that we have punters buing STs next season. Also the cup ties this year must be played as finals. And I mean all of them.

Sorry for the negativity but it is how I am feeling this morning.
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SaMule
31 Jul 2014, 08:44 AM
Silent Witness
31 Jul 2014, 05:32 AM
Whilst it is tempting to focus the blame on individuals or a group for failures, I find myself in a minority that wonders what it is that the board is doing so wrong ? I think that they are obliged to operate under business principles, and even operating a football business is not that challenging compared with other business entities.

The charge that they do not invest or spend money is simply untrue. They do, but if the money invested last season did not yield value for money, then that is a failing of the footballing operation (and regarding, the buy low, sell high policy, it was only valid for some, not all of our signings). The screams for greater investment stem from the relatively narrow horizon's of British football culture. Most of the EPL clubs are subsidy junkies, while aims of an average SPL club are modest to say the least. I would also ask how the investment strategies of the other CL qualifying clubs compare with ours. Given the level of investment in the current team, if anything, we are entitled ask why we are not getting better value for that ? This does not suggest a board that is failing. Rather, it suggests that our whole footballing operation is lacking in professionalism, compared even to smaller clubs in Europe.
That's pretty much how I see it too. They do spend in a way that's commensurate with our income, but they have an unfortunate tendency to spend it on players (and occasionally managers) that aren't very good.

I'm happy for the overall strategy to stay the same, but it's surely time to change some of the personnel involved in directing that strategy as the returns are diminishing year on year.
SW and SM You cant see the wood for the trees.
PL and the board control the appointment of the football dept, sanction signings etc

The buck has to stop with them at some point.
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SaMule
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NSFW
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Estoril
31 Jul 2014, 09:04 AM
SaMule
31 Jul 2014, 08:44 AM
Silent Witness
31 Jul 2014, 05:32 AM
Whilst it is tempting to focus the blame on individuals or a group for failures, I find myself in a minority that wonders what it is that the board is doing so wrong ? I think that they are obliged to operate under business principles, and even operating a football business is not that challenging compared with other business entities.

The charge that they do not invest or spend money is simply untrue. They do, but if the money invested last season did not yield value for money, then that is a failing of the footballing operation (and regarding, the buy low, sell high policy, it was only valid for some, not all of our signings). The screams for greater investment stem from the relatively narrow horizon's of British football culture. Most of the EPL clubs are subsidy junkies, while aims of an average SPL club are modest to say the least. I would also ask how the investment strategies of the other CL qualifying clubs compare with ours. Given the level of investment in the current team, if anything, we are entitled ask why we are not getting better value for that ? This does not suggest a board that is failing. Rather, it suggests that our whole footballing operation is lacking in professionalism, compared even to smaller clubs in Europe.
That's pretty much how I see it too. They do spend in a way that's commensurate with our income, but they have an unfortunate tendency to spend it on players (and occasionally managers) that aren't very good.

I'm happy for the overall strategy to stay the same, but it's surely time to change some of the personnel involved in directing that strategy as the returns are diminishing year on year.
SW and SM You cant see the wood for the trees.
PL and the board control the appointment of the football dept, sanction signings etc

The buck has to stop with them at some point.
Which is exactly what I said :ponder:
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lynch1888
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McStay
31 Jul 2014, 03:30 AM
stevie w f hegel
31 Jul 2014, 02:07 AM
Lawwell is doing fine. Really. We aren't going to challenge in Europe. EVER. Give it up.
Bollocks. Nobody is moaning about Lawwell because our chances of winning the CL have took a hit. It's the fact the constant downsizing has finally come back to haunt us and we've been humbled by a team we shouldn't have been. We lost 4-1 going on 8 ffs.

Our last manager left because of this pish. Our new one was the cheap option (one I back, though). The squad is a joke. Buy low, sell high. That's the strategy yet what we're now doing is selling high and not even buying/replacing never mind replacing adequately.

Enough is enough. We've made a fortune on player sales and CL success. Our season ticket prices are a joke considering the quality of football in this country and yet, with all of that, we found ourselves playing Kris Commons up front and Charlie Mulgrew in midfield tonight. We're being taken for a ride.
:potm: :clap:
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Mackin
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The Ginty McGinty genius
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Its been time for Lawwell to go for at least 5 years.

How much money has he cost us now, when you add up costing us 4 in a row in 2009, missing the CL for 3 years, and now about to miss it again?

He has chased Balde, Ledley, and Samaras over money, and will no doubt have Forster and van Dijk out the door by this time next week while we are left to watch carrots like Mulgrew, Stokes and Griffiths for the rest of the season.

How much money has he made in this time as the highest paid employee at the club?

If he comes out with Fergus on flag day, hes in for a hell of a noise.

:carrot:
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Zurawski 7
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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"I think last night's result may have been on the cards. There has been no investment in the team."

"The last 6 months wasn't enjoyable. I started getting angry with the players which is not a good sign."

Neil Lennon speaking on @bbc5live
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quattrobhoy
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After Seville, MON said we'd "have to get used to life in the slow lane". I'm beginning to suspect that we could be stuck on the hard shoulder.
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