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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,414,828 Views)
Willie Wonka
Member Avatar
Slavery fled, oh glorious dead
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Fearghas
8 Sep 2015, 08:49 PM
geezerbhoy
6 Sep 2015, 12:23 PM
cfc88cfc
4 Sep 2015, 11:42 PM
Lawwell has took a risk every year not making significant signings until our champions league fate is decided, was the same under Lennon. If we had spent a few million on a couple of decent players we would have had a better chance of qualifying each year and would of made a fortune in champions league revenue. But no Lawwell would rather take a gamble and try get us in to the group stages spending as little as possible. Putting the whole transfer dealings to the side, Lawwell is still a complete tit in dealing with other aspects of the club. From not paying staff the living wage to zero hour contracts to not having a charity as our sponsor. Lawwell would probably have voted to allow Sevco in to the SPL if it wasn't from the pressure the fans put on him. The club even had plans in place to change season ticket prices only if the huns got promoted last season ffs. I'm sure I even read somewhere that we didn't even have a club doctor with us during that friendly with Real Madrid when McGeough got injured due to cut backs, astonishing. Something really must be done to bring about change or we're going to be seeing the same thing continue. Getting some sort of fan ownership/representation on the board is definitely the way forward. I could ramble on all night about my hatred for Lawwell.
ive read some pish on this thread , but that is sensational
can't see a whole lot wrong with it myself tbh
Op seems to want give money away, admirable though the aims are and still spend more?

The problem isn't this window, as Corky's post suggests this goes back years. The income from CL and transfers is paying the wages of players who aren't up to it.
The 'system' is broken, instead of taking a punt on guys like balde and pukki we should hang onto the cash until better is available, ideally the next may or June in time for the next dose of :twitch: qualifiers.
Those guys contributed nothing.
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tomtheleedstim
First-team captain
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Corky Buczek
8 Sep 2015, 05:27 PM
*edit on dates*

Go back to season 2008/9. Much has been said about the failure to land Steven Fletcher when our strikers couldn't buy a goal.

But the malaise started in the summer of 2008 and not Jan 2009. Strachan asked for a centre half and a holding midfielder. We ended up with Crosas and Loovens and so began the now annual trawl of the fag end of the transfer market come the end of August each year .

The following year saw Mowbray hired after Owen Coyle turned us down after a botched PL negotiation. Mowbray thought he was going to get another centre half before the season started but it never materialised - a scenario that the two subsequent managers have both experienced. In all fairness a new centre half wouldn't have stopped the train wreck that was Mogga, although I have long since argued that all he did was continue in the same vein as he done with WBA the season before.

And so Neil Lennon was hired. A manager with no experience who had lost a semi final against lower division opposition - and on a salary of less than half what PL was earning. He would also have to get used to his assets being sold and then much of that money being used to cover the losses. In fairness after a sluggish start, Lenny started to win over the doubters like myself. We made CL twice - even making the last 16. Although the second time it was by the skin of our teeth.

The second CL qualification occurred after our now legendary transfer policy of wait and see as to how we progress in Europe began. It was clear during that season that Lennon was getting fed up with it. I'm not one of ones on this board that knew some of the previous coaching staff but it came as no surprise to me that Lennon packed it in when he did.

And so to Ronnie. Someone who initially was all set to be our assistant gets the top job after the likes of Roy Keane and Henrik turn us down. The idea that these two would have made good Celtic managers should set the alarm bells ringing never mind the fact we ended up with the guy who was earmarked to be their assistant.

Last summer saw shambles of a transfer window as we signed various players on loan (after the manager saying he didn't fancy such a scenario) but none in time to stop our possibly worst ever August in Europe as we were thrashed home and away by Legia and duffed by the giant that is Maribor. To go onto these games with Anthony Stokes as a lone striker really tells you all you need to now about how badly we were prepared. After a dreadful start, we seemed to find some kind of form and after - for once - a decent window in January, we had 4 in a row.

Then along comes another summer. We knew at the start that we would have to find two new centre halves as Denayer was not going to stay and this was VVD's last season. Ronnie wanted a left back and given that Guidetti was going to go and there were clearly question marks against Scepovic, we were going to need at least one probably two strikers.

So how have we done. Long term aim is for Boyata and Simovic to replace VVD and Denayer. Boyata gives you the fear on the ball and big Croat wiil take time to adjust and probably needs to toughen up if we are to believe reports, quotes and some comments from Zagreb fans. It could well be that Blackett plays at centre half for much of this season. At left back, after agreeing terms and fee for Mitchell Dijks, we then ended up with nobody. PL it seems, wants us to believe that was no other left back out there that was improvement on Charlie or Izzy - both on whom would be spectacularly bad over the two legs against Malmo.

As for the strikers, by all accounts Ronnie wanted Ciftci and we fought off Wigan for his signature. Enuff said - I suspect that will come back to haunt him. To not even bother replacing Scepovic is just negligence. As with Steven Fletcher at the start of this post, PL has rolled the dice once more and erred on the side of doing NOT enough to get by.

We currently have a Chief Exec who gets paid double what the management team does. His salary has gone on leaps and bounds whilst attendances and turnover falls and we have qualified just twice for the CL in seven seasons. In that time the likes of Braga, Utrecht, Happoel Tel Aviv, Maribor and Malmo have fed us our dinner in Europe with technicalities preventing Legia and Sion from joining that list. If you want to go back a further season in 2007/8, we finished bottom of a CL group behind Copenhagen.

In the past seven seasons, we have won 4 leagues, two league cups and two Scottish Cups. 8 trophies in total when for the past three years, there has been no real challenge. Is that good enough ? Is that enough to justify the CEO as the second highest paid person at the club ?

We hire rockie managers who blew it in Europe to begin with. I don't doubt that RD must have the finger pointed at him for getting caught on the break after 57 minutes when 2-0 up at home, but why are we hiring managers with no experience.

I'm sure that balance sheet s great but you don't need to hire a CEO on £1M a year if all you are going to do sell and rationalise the business. If you read the likes of CQN, there are those who think PL and the board are some sort of alchemists, turning raw material into gold. Well 2 visits to the CL in seven years and only eight domestic trophies in that time, really should put paid to such nonsense.

Under PL and DD we are going nowhere. If the pressure gets to much for Deila this year, then expect him to be replaced by another novice or a great former player with a chequered managerial career. They will not prepare properly for European qualifiers, That is the extent of the ambition.

If another Scottish club ever did get its act together, we would struggle because those running Celtic seem to think they are doing a great job when actually they are failing badly.
Excellent post fella.
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Wee Ed KTF
Considering retirement
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tomtheleedstim
8 Sep 2015, 10:29 PM
Corky Buczek
8 Sep 2015, 05:27 PM
*edit on dates*

Go back to season 2008/9. Much has been said about the failure to land Steven Fletcher when our strikers couldn't buy a goal.

But the malaise started in the summer of 2008 and not Jan 2009. Strachan asked for a centre half and a holding midfielder. We ended up with Crosas and Loovens and so began the now annual trawl of the fag end of the transfer market come the end of August each year .

The following year saw Mowbray hired after Owen Coyle turned us down after a botched PL negotiation. Mowbray thought he was going to get another centre half before the season started but it never materialised - a scenario that the two subsequent managers have both experienced. In all fairness a new centre half wouldn't have stopped the train wreck that was Mogga, although I have long since argued that all he did was continue in the same vein as he done with WBA the season before.

And so Neil Lennon was hired. A manager with no experience who had lost a semi final against lower division opposition - and on a salary of less than half what PL was earning. He would also have to get used to his assets being sold and then much of that money being used to cover the losses. In fairness after a sluggish start, Lenny started to win over the doubters like myself. We made CL twice - even making the last 16. Although the second time it was by the skin of our teeth.

The second CL qualification occurred after our now legendary transfer policy of wait and see as to how we progress in Europe began. It was clear during that season that Lennon was getting fed up with it. I'm not one of ones on this board that knew some of the previous coaching staff but it came as no surprise to me that Lennon packed it in when he did.

And so to Ronnie. Someone who initially was all set to be our assistant gets the top job after the likes of Roy Keane and Henrik turn us down. The idea that these two would have made good Celtic managers should set the alarm bells ringing never mind the fact we ended up with the guy who was earmarked to be their assistant.

Last summer saw shambles of a transfer window as we signed various players on loan (after the manager saying he didn't fancy such a scenario) but none in time to stop our possibly worst ever August in Europe as we were thrashed home and away by Legia and duffed by the giant that is Maribor. To go onto these games with Anthony Stokes as a lone striker really tells you all you need to now about how badly we were prepared. After a dreadful start, we seemed to find some kind of form and after - for once - a decent window in January, we had 4 in a row.

Then along comes another summer. We knew at the start that we would have to find two new centre halves as Denayer was not going to stay and this was VVD's last season. Ronnie wanted a left back and given that Guidetti was going to go and there were clearly question marks against Scepovic, we were going to need at least one probably two strikers.

So how have we done. Long term aim is for Boyata and Simovic to replace VVD and Denayer. Boyata gives you the fear on the ball and big Croat wiil take time to adjust and probably needs to toughen up if we are to believe reports, quotes and some comments from Zagreb fans. It could well be that Blackett plays at centre half for much of this season. At left back, after agreeing terms and fee for Mitchell Dijks, we then ended up with nobody. PL it seems, wants us to believe that was no other left back out there that was improvement on Charlie or Izzy - both on whom would be spectacularly bad over the two legs against Malmo.

As for the strikers, by all accounts Ronnie wanted Ciftci and we fought off Wigan for his signature. Enuff said - I suspect that will come back to haunt him. To not even bother replacing Scepovic is just negligence. As with Steven Fletcher at the start of this post, PL has rolled the dice once more and erred on the side of doing NOT enough to get by.

We currently have a Chief Exec who gets paid double what the management team does. His salary has gone on leaps and bounds whilst attendances and turnover falls and we have qualified just twice for the CL in seven seasons. In that time the likes of Braga, Utrecht, Happoel Tel Aviv, Maribor and Malmo have fed us our dinner in Europe with technicalities preventing Legia and Sion from joining that list. If you want to go back a further season in 2007/8, we finished bottom of a CL group behind Copenhagen.

In the past seven seasons, we have won 4 leagues, two league cups and two Scottish Cups. 8 trophies in total when for the past three years, there has been no real challenge. Is that good enough ? Is that enough to justify the CEO as the second highest paid person at the club ?

We hire rockie managers who blew it in Europe to begin with. I don't doubt that RD must have the finger pointed at him for getting caught on the break after 57 minutes when 2-0 up at home, but why are we hiring managers with no experience.

I'm sure that balance sheet s great but you don't need to hire a CEO on £1M a year if all you are going to do sell and rationalise the business. If you read the likes of CQN, there are those who think PL and the board are some sort of alchemists, turning raw material into gold. Well 2 visits to the CL in seven years and only eight domestic trophies in that time, really should put paid to such nonsense.

Under PL and DD we are going nowhere. If the pressure gets to much for Deila this year, then expect him to be replaced by another novice or a great former player with a chequered managerial career. They will not prepare properly for European qualifiers, That is the extent of the ambition.

If another Scottish club ever did get its act together, we would struggle because those running Celtic seem to think they are doing a great job when actually they are failing badly.
Excellent post fella.
:thumbsup:

Yep, good post, Corky
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Winds of Change CSC
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Corky Buczek
8 Sep 2015, 05:27 PM
*edit on dates*

Go back to season 2008/9. Much has been said about the failure to land Steven Fletcher when our strikers couldn't buy a goal.

But the malaise started in the summer of 2008 and not Jan 2009. Strachan asked for a centre half and a holding midfielder. We ended up with Crosas and Loovens and so began the now annual trawl of the fag end of the transfer market come the end of August each year .

The following year saw Mowbray hired after Owen Coyle turned us down after a botched PL negotiation. Mowbray thought he was going to get another centre half before the season started but it never materialised - a scenario that the two subsequent managers have both experienced. In all fairness a new centre half wouldn't have stopped the train wreck that was Mogga, although I have long since argued that all he did was continue in the same vein as he done with WBA the season before.

And so Neil Lennon was hired. A manager with no experience who had lost a semi final against lower division opposition - and on a salary of less than half what PL was earning. He would also have to get used to his assets being sold and then much of that money being used to cover the losses. In fairness after a sluggish start, Lenny started to win over the doubters like myself. We made CL twice - even making the last 16. Although the second time it was by the skin of our teeth.

The second CL qualification occurred after our now legendary transfer policy of wait and see as to how we progress in Europe began. It was clear during that season that Lennon was getting fed up with it. I'm not one of ones on this board that knew some of the previous coaching staff but it came as no surprise to me that Lennon packed it in when he did.

And so to Ronnie. Someone who initially was all set to be our assistant gets the top job after the likes of Roy Keane and Henrik turn us down. The idea that these two would have made good Celtic managers should set the alarm bells ringing never mind the fact we ended up with the guy who was earmarked to be their assistant.

Last summer saw shambles of a transfer window as we signed various players on loan (after the manager saying he didn't fancy such a scenario) but none in time to stop our possibly worst ever August in Europe as we were thrashed home and away by Legia and duffed by the giant that is Maribor. To go onto these games with Anthony Stokes as a lone striker really tells you all you need to now about how badly we were prepared. After a dreadful start, we seemed to find some kind of form and after - for once - a decent window in January, we had 4 in a row.

Then along comes another summer. We knew at the start that we would have to find two new centre halves as Denayer was not going to stay and this was VVD's last season. Ronnie wanted a left back and given that Guidetti was going to go and there were clearly question marks against Scepovic, we were going to need at least one probably two strikers.

So how have we done. Long term aim is for Boyata and Simovic to replace VVD and Denayer. Boyata gives you the fear on the ball and big Croat wiil take time to adjust and probably needs to toughen up if we are to believe reports, quotes and some comments from Zagreb fans. It could well be that Blackett plays at centre half for much of this season. At left back, after agreeing terms and fee for Mitchell Dijks, we then ended up with nobody. PL it seems, wants us to believe that was no other left back out there that was improvement on Charlie or Izzy - both on whom would be spectacularly bad over the two legs against Malmo.

As for the strikers, by all accounts Ronnie wanted Ciftci and we fought off Wigan for his signature. Enuff said - I suspect that will come back to haunt him. To not even bother replacing Scepovic is just negligence. As with Steven Fletcher at the start of this post, PL has rolled the dice once more and erred on the side of doing NOT enough to get by.

We currently have a Chief Exec who gets paid double what the management team does. His salary has gone on leaps and bounds whilst attendances and turnover falls and we have qualified just twice for the CL in seven seasons. In that time the likes of Braga, Utrecht, Happoel Tel Aviv, Maribor and Malmo have fed us our dinner in Europe with technicalities preventing Legia and Sion from joining that list. If you want to go back a further season in 2007/8, we finished bottom of a CL group behind Copenhagen.

In the past seven seasons, we have won 4 leagues, two league cups and two Scottish Cups. 8 trophies in total when for the past three years, there has been no real challenge. Is that good enough ? Is that enough to justify the CEO as the second highest paid person at the club ?

We hire rockie managers who blew it in Europe to begin with. I don't doubt that RD must have the finger pointed at him for getting caught on the break after 57 minutes when 2-0 up at home, but why are we hiring managers with no experience.

I'm sure that balance sheet s great but you don't need to hire a CEO on £1M a year if all you are going to do sell and rationalise the business. If you read the likes of CQN, there are those who think PL and the board are some sort of alchemists, turning raw material into gold. Well 2 visits to the CL in seven years and only eight domestic trophies in that time, really should put paid to such nonsense.

Under PL and DD we are going nowhere. If the pressure gets to much for Deila this year, then expect him to be replaced by another novice or a great former player with a chequered managerial career. They will not prepare properly for European qualifiers, That is the extent of the ambition.

If another Scottish club ever did get its act together, we would struggle because those running Celtic seem to think they are doing a great job when actually they are failing badly.
Nail on the head.

With Lawwell the common factor throughout the farce, coining it in every step of the way.
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murphio
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Could start a row in an empty room
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Winds of Change CSC
9 Sep 2015, 12:22 AM
With Lawwell the common factor throughout the farce, coining it in every step of the way.
To me, that is the most curious thing. Profit down, full bonus. Debt up, full bonus. Turnover down, full bonus. Share price down, full bonus. League lost, full bonus. Champions League missed, full bonus. All the people who say "he must be doing something right" point to an interesting question which can only be explained - as someone did last week - that a 'bonus' comes with certain tax relief benefits. I have no idea if this is correct but it's the only conclusion I can come to. Peter Lawwell is surely the most fortunate CEO in business. A core income which is virtually guaranteed regardless of performance. Customer brand loyalty which is unprecedented in any other industry. I mean, WTF are we paying this guy a million quid a year for? An effing monkey could do the same job.
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Faust
Member Avatar
Everyone's Fantasy Football first pick
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Corky Buczek
8 Sep 2015, 05:27 PM
*edit on dates*

Go back to season 2008/9. Much has been said about the failure to land Steven Fletcher when our strikers couldn't buy a goal.

But the malaise started in the summer of 2008 and not Jan 2009. Strachan asked for a centre half and a holding midfielder. We ended up with Crosas and Loovens and so began the now annual trawl of the fag end of the transfer market come the end of August each year .

The following year saw Mowbray hired after Owen Coyle turned us down after a botched PL negotiation. Mowbray thought he was going to get another centre half before the season started but it never materialised - a scenario that the two subsequent managers have both experienced. In all fairness a new centre half wouldn't have stopped the train wreck that was Mogga, although I have long since argued that all he did was continue in the same vein as he done with WBA the season before.

And so Neil Lennon was hired. A manager with no experience who had lost a semi final against lower division opposition - and on a salary of less than half what PL was earning. He would also have to get used to his assets being sold and then much of that money being used to cover the losses. In fairness after a sluggish start, Lenny started to win over the doubters like myself. We made CL twice - even making the last 16. Although the second time it was by the skin of our teeth.

The second CL qualification occurred after our now legendary transfer policy of wait and see as to how we progress in Europe began. It was clear during that season that Lennon was getting fed up with it. I'm not one of ones on this board that knew some of the previous coaching staff but it came as no surprise to me that Lennon packed it in when he did.

And so to Ronnie. Someone who initially was all set to be our assistant gets the top job after the likes of Roy Keane and Henrik turn us down. The idea that these two would have made good Celtic managers should set the alarm bells ringing never mind the fact we ended up with the guy who was earmarked to be their assistant.

Last summer saw shambles of a transfer window as we signed various players on loan (after the manager saying he didn't fancy such a scenario) but none in time to stop our possibly worst ever August in Europe as we were thrashed home and away by Legia and duffed by the giant that is Maribor. To go onto these games with Anthony Stokes as a lone striker really tells you all you need to now about how badly we were prepared. After a dreadful start, we seemed to find some kind of form and after - for once - a decent window in January, we had 4 in a row.

Then along comes another summer. We knew at the start that we would have to find two new centre halves as Denayer was not going to stay and this was VVD's last season. Ronnie wanted a left back and given that Guidetti was going to go and there were clearly question marks against Scepovic, we were going to need at least one probably two strikers.

So how have we done. Long term aim is for Boyata and Simovic to replace VVD and Denayer. Boyata gives you the fear on the ball and big Croat wiil take time to adjust and probably needs to toughen up if we are to believe reports, quotes and some comments from Zagreb fans. It could well be that Blackett plays at centre half for much of this season. At left back, after agreeing terms and fee for Mitchell Dijks, we then ended up with nobody. PL it seems, wants us to believe that was no other left back out there that was improvement on Charlie or Izzy - both on whom would be spectacularly bad over the two legs against Malmo.

As for the strikers, by all accounts Ronnie wanted Ciftci and we fought off Wigan for his signature. Enuff said - I suspect that will come back to haunt him. To not even bother replacing Scepovic is just negligence. As with Steven Fletcher at the start of this post, PL has rolled the dice once more and erred on the side of doing NOT enough to get by.

We currently have a Chief Exec who gets paid double what the management team does. His salary has gone on leaps and bounds whilst attendances and turnover falls and we have qualified just twice for the CL in seven seasons. In that time the likes of Braga, Utrecht, Happoel Tel Aviv, Maribor and Malmo have fed us our dinner in Europe with technicalities preventing Legia and Sion from joining that list. If you want to go back a further season in 2007/8, we finished bottom of a CL group behind Copenhagen.

In the past seven seasons, we have won 4 leagues, two league cups and two Scottish Cups. 8 trophies in total when for the past three years, there has been no real challenge. Is that good enough ? Is that enough to justify the CEO as the second highest paid person at the club ?

We hire rockie managers who blew it in Europe to begin with. I don't doubt that RD must have the finger pointed at him for getting caught on the break after 57 minutes when 2-0 up at home, but why are we hiring managers with no experience.

I'm sure that balance sheet s great but you don't need to hire a CEO on £1M a year if all you are going to do sell and rationalise the business. If you read the likes of CQN, there are those who think PL and the board are some sort of alchemists, turning raw material into gold. Well 2 visits to the CL in seven years and only eight domestic trophies in that time, really should put paid to such nonsense.

Under PL and DD we are going nowhere. If the pressure gets to much for Deila this year, then expect him to be replaced by another novice or a great former player with a chequered managerial career. They will not prepare properly for European qualifiers, That is the extent of the ambition.

If another Scottish club ever did get its act together, we would struggle because those running Celtic seem to think they are doing a great job when actually they are failing badly.
Chapeau, Corky!

It is a funny old day when we have better unpaid analysts of our situation on fansites like this than the man in the well-upholstered CE's chair who is paid a king's ransom to do the same, but fails time after time

You have also put your finger on the rampant culture of entitlement that pertains at CP.

Time for both the detached organ-grinder and his monkey to move on and let committed professionals take over.
Edited by Faust, 9 Sep 2015, 01:07 AM.
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Ned Rise
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These boots were made for hunbustin'
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Corky Buczek
8 Sep 2015, 05:27 PM
*edit on dates*

Go back to season 2008/9. Much has been said about the failure to land Steven Fletcher when our strikers couldn't buy a goal.

But the malaise started in the summer of 2008 and not Jan 2009. Strachan asked for a centre half and a holding midfielder. We ended up with Crosas and Loovens and so began the now annual trawl of the fag end of the transfer market come the end of August each year .

The following year saw Mowbray hired after Owen Coyle turned us down after a botched PL negotiation. Mowbray thought he was going to get another centre half before the season started but it never materialised - a scenario that the two subsequent managers have both experienced. In all fairness a new centre half wouldn't have stopped the train wreck that was Mogga, although I have long since argued that all he did was continue in the same vein as he done with WBA the season before.

And so Neil Lennon was hired. A manager with no experience who had lost a semi final against lower division opposition - and on a salary of less than half what PL was earning. He would also have to get used to his assets being sold and then much of that money being used to cover the losses. In fairness after a sluggish start, Lenny started to win over the doubters like myself. We made CL twice - even making the last 16. Although the second time it was by the skin of our teeth.

The second CL qualification occurred after our now legendary transfer policy of wait and see as to how we progress in Europe began. It was clear during that season that Lennon was getting fed up with it. I'm not one of ones on this board that knew some of the previous coaching staff but it came as no surprise to me that Lennon packed it in when he did.

And so to Ronnie. Someone who initially was all set to be our assistant gets the top job after the likes of Roy Keane and Henrik turn us down. The idea that these two would have made good Celtic managers should set the alarm bells ringing never mind the fact we ended up with the guy who was earmarked to be their assistant.

Last summer saw shambles of a transfer window as we signed various players on loan (after the manager saying he didn't fancy such a scenario) but none in time to stop our possibly worst ever August in Europe as we were thrashed home and away by Legia and duffed by the giant that is Maribor. To go onto these games with Anthony Stokes as a lone striker really tells you all you need to now about how badly we were prepared. After a dreadful start, we seemed to find some kind of form and after - for once - a decent window in January, we had 4 in a row.

Then along comes another summer. We knew at the start that we would have to find two new centre halves as Denayer was not going to stay and this was VVD's last season. Ronnie wanted a left back and given that Guidetti was going to go and there were clearly question marks against Scepovic, we were going to need at least one probably two strikers.

So how have we done. Long term aim is for Boyata and Simovic to replace VVD and Denayer. Boyata gives you the fear on the ball and big Croat wiil take time to adjust and probably needs to toughen up if we are to believe reports, quotes and some comments from Zagreb fans. It could well be that Blackett plays at centre half for much of this season. At left back, after agreeing terms and fee for Mitchell Dijks, we then ended up with nobody. PL it seems, wants us to believe that was no other left back out there that was improvement on Charlie or Izzy - both on whom would be spectacularly bad over the two legs against Malmo.

As for the strikers, by all accounts Ronnie wanted Ciftci and we fought off Wigan for his signature. Enuff said - I suspect that will come back to haunt him. To not even bother replacing Scepovic is just negligence. As with Steven Fletcher at the start of this post, PL has rolled the dice once more and erred on the side of doing NOT enough to get by.

We currently have a Chief Exec who gets paid double what the management team does. His salary has gone on leaps and bounds whilst attendances and turnover falls and we have qualified just twice for the CL in seven seasons. In that time the likes of Braga, Utrecht, Happoel Tel Aviv, Maribor and Malmo have fed us our dinner in Europe with technicalities preventing Legia and Sion from joining that list. If you want to go back a further season in 2007/8, we finished bottom of a CL group behind Copenhagen.

In the past seven seasons, we have won 4 leagues, two league cups and two Scottish Cups. 8 trophies in total when for the past three years, there has been no real challenge. Is that good enough ? Is that enough to justify the CEO as the second highest paid person at the club ?

We hire rockie managers who blew it in Europe to begin with. I don't doubt that RD must have the finger pointed at him for getting caught on the break after 57 minutes when 2-0 up at home, but why are we hiring managers with no experience.

I'm sure that balance sheet s great but you don't need to hire a CEO on £1M a year if all you are going to do sell and rationalise the business. If you read the likes of CQN, there are those who think PL and the board are some sort of alchemists, turning raw material into gold. Well 2 visits to the CL in seven years and only eight domestic trophies in that time, really should put paid to such nonsense.

Under PL and DD we are going nowhere. If the pressure gets to much for Deila this year, then expect him to be replaced by another novice or a great former player with a chequered managerial career. They will not prepare properly for European qualifiers, That is the extent of the ambition.

If another Scottish club ever did get its act together, we would struggle because those running Celtic seem to think they are doing a great job when actually they are failing badly.
That nails it.

The only thing I'd add is that I think the decline is managed in parallel with the lowering of expectations. In some ways, we are where we are because that's what the objective is.
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Big_Bobo_Balde
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Speculate to accumulate is not in the current boards thoughts, shelf life has expired.
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sevilliano
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Faust
9 Sep 2015, 01:06 AM
Corky Buczek
8 Sep 2015, 05:27 PM
*edit on dates*

Go back to season 2008/9. Much has been said about the failure to land Steven Fletcher when our strikers couldn't buy a goal.

But the malaise started in the summer of 2008 and not Jan 2009. Strachan asked for a centre half and a holding midfielder. We ended up with Crosas and Loovens and so began the now annual trawl of the fag end of the transfer market come the end of August each year .

The following year saw Mowbray hired after Owen Coyle turned us down after a botched PL negotiation. Mowbray thought he was going to get another centre half before the season started but it never materialised - a scenario that the two subsequent managers have both experienced. In all fairness a new centre half wouldn't have stopped the train wreck that was Mogga, although I have long since argued that all he did was continue in the same vein as he done with WBA the season before.

And so Neil Lennon was hired. A manager with no experience who had lost a semi final against lower division opposition - and on a salary of less than half what PL was earning. He would also have to get used to his assets being sold and then much of that money being used to cover the losses. In fairness after a sluggish start, Lenny started to win over the doubters like myself. We made CL twice - even making the last 16. Although the second time it was by the skin of our teeth.

The second CL qualification occurred after our now legendary transfer policy of wait and see as to how we progress in Europe began. It was clear during that season that Lennon was getting fed up with it. I'm not one of ones on this board that knew some of the previous coaching staff but it came as no surprise to me that Lennon packed it in when he did.

And so to Ronnie. Someone who initially was all set to be our assistant gets the top job after the likes of Roy Keane and Henrik turn us down. The idea that these two would have made good Celtic managers should set the alarm bells ringing never mind the fact we ended up with the guy who was earmarked to be their assistant.

Last summer saw shambles of a transfer window as we signed various players on loan (after the manager saying he didn't fancy such a scenario) but none in time to stop our possibly worst ever August in Europe as we were thrashed home and away by Legia and duffed by the giant that is Maribor. To go onto these games with Anthony Stokes as a lone striker really tells you all you need to now about how badly we were prepared. After a dreadful start, we seemed to find some kind of form and after - for once - a decent window in January, we had 4 in a row.

Then along comes another summer. We knew at the start that we would have to find two new centre halves as Denayer was not going to stay and this was VVD's last season. Ronnie wanted a left back and given that Guidetti was going to go and there were clearly question marks against Scepovic, we were going to need at least one probably two strikers.

So how have we done. Long term aim is for Boyata and Simovic to replace VVD and Denayer. Boyata gives you the fear on the ball and big Croat wiil take time to adjust and probably needs to toughen up if we are to believe reports, quotes and some comments from Zagreb fans. It could well be that Blackett plays at centre half for much of this season. At left back, after agreeing terms and fee for Mitchell Dijks, we then ended up with nobody. PL it seems, wants us to believe that was no other left back out there that was improvement on Charlie or Izzy - both on whom would be spectacularly bad over the two legs against Malmo.

As for the strikers, by all accounts Ronnie wanted Ciftci and we fought off Wigan for his signature. Enuff said - I suspect that will come back to haunt him. To not even bother replacing Scepovic is just negligence. As with Steven Fletcher at the start of this post, PL has rolled the dice once more and erred on the side of doing NOT enough to get by.

We currently have a Chief Exec who gets paid double what the management team does. His salary has gone on leaps and bounds whilst attendances and turnover falls and we have qualified just twice for the CL in seven seasons. In that time the likes of Braga, Utrecht, Happoel Tel Aviv, Maribor and Malmo have fed us our dinner in Europe with technicalities preventing Legia and Sion from joining that list. If you want to go back a further season in 2007/8, we finished bottom of a CL group behind Copenhagen.

In the past seven seasons, we have won 4 leagues, two league cups and two Scottish Cups. 8 trophies in total when for the past three years, there has been no real challenge. Is that good enough ? Is that enough to justify the CEO as the second highest paid person at the club ?

We hire rockie managers who blew it in Europe to begin with. I don't doubt that RD must have the finger pointed at him for getting caught on the break after 57 minutes when 2-0 up at home, but why are we hiring managers with no experience.

I'm sure that balance sheet s great but you don't need to hire a CEO on £1M a year if all you are going to do sell and rationalise the business. If you read the likes of CQN, there are those who think PL and the board are some sort of alchemists, turning raw material into gold. Well 2 visits to the CL in seven years and only eight domestic trophies in that time, really should put paid to such nonsense.

Under PL and DD we are going nowhere. If the pressure gets to much for Deila this year, then expect him to be replaced by another novice or a great former player with a chequered managerial career. They will not prepare properly for European qualifiers, That is the extent of the ambition.

If another Scottish club ever did get its act together, we would struggle because those running Celtic seem to think they are doing a great job when actually they are failing badly.
Chapeau, Corky!

It is a funny old day when we have better unpaid analysts of our situation on fansites like this than the man in the well-upholstered CE's chair who is paid a king's ransom to do the same, but fails time after time

You have also put your finger on the rampant culture of entitlement that pertains at CP.

Time for both the detached organ-grinder and his monkey to move on and let committed professionals take over.
:worthy: Corky

Will get this to one of those at the heart of this culture of entitlement
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DKB
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murphio
9 Sep 2015, 12:30 AM
Winds of Change CSC
9 Sep 2015, 12:22 AM
With Lawwell the common factor throughout the farce, coining it in every step of the way.
To me, that is the most curious thing. Profit down, full bonus. Debt up, full bonus. Turnover down, full bonus. Share price down, full bonus. League lost, full bonus. Champions League missed, full bonus. All the people who say "he must be doing something right" point to an interesting question which can only be explained - as someone did last week - that a 'bonus' comes with certain tax relief benefits. I have no idea if this is correct but it's the only conclusion I can come to. Peter Lawwell is surely the most fortunate CEO in business. A core income which is virtually guaranteed regardless of performance. Customer brand loyalty which is unprecedented in any other industry. I mean, WTF are we paying this guy a million quid a year for? An effing monkey could do the same job.
They have tried that on the other side of Glasgow, even changed the monkey out a couple of times, didn't work out for them

Actual think that PL is doing a good job for the club (notice I doesn't say for the team) - The basis wage should be lower though, with the rest up the famous £1m in on how the team does

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greenjedi
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Look the problem is our largest shareholder who controls the board. The club is run the way he wants it to be. Changing the CEO, Manager etc is mearly shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic.
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idyllwild


murphio
9 Sep 2015, 12:30 AM
Winds of Change CSC
9 Sep 2015, 12:22 AM
With Lawwell the common factor throughout the farce, coining it in every step of the way.
To me, that is the most curious thing. Profit down, full bonus. Debt up, full bonus. Turnover down, full bonus. Share price down, full bonus. League lost, full bonus. Champions League missed, full bonus. All the people who say "he must be doing something right" point to an interesting question which can only be explained - as someone did last week - that a 'bonus' comes with certain tax relief benefits. I have no idea if this is correct but it's the only conclusion I can come to. Peter Lawwell is surely the most fortunate CEO in business. A core income which is virtually guaranteed regardless of performance. Customer brand loyalty which is unprecedented in any other industry. I mean, WTF are we paying this guy a million quid a year for? An effing monkey could do the same job.
A bonus is taxed at the same rate as normal salary. I don't think there are any benefits that come with being paid a cash bonus as opposed to a cash salary.

The only differences are the timing and the supposed arbitrary nature of the bonus.

Presuming his bonus works the usual way, he'll start with a fixed % of his salary, which will then be amended by a multiple based on some combination of his performance, business performance, share price, and any other factors considered appropriate.
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pads99
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idyllwild
9 Sep 2015, 10:11 AM
murphio
9 Sep 2015, 12:30 AM
Winds of Change CSC
9 Sep 2015, 12:22 AM
With Lawwell the common factor throughout the farce, coining it in every step of the way.
To me, that is the most curious thing. Profit down, full bonus. Debt up, full bonus. Turnover down, full bonus. Share price down, full bonus. League lost, full bonus. Champions League missed, full bonus. All the people who say "he must be doing something right" point to an interesting question which can only be explained - as someone did last week - that a 'bonus' comes with certain tax relief benefits. I have no idea if this is correct but it's the only conclusion I can come to. Peter Lawwell is surely the most fortunate CEO in business. A core income which is virtually guaranteed regardless of performance. Customer brand loyalty which is unprecedented in any other industry. I mean, WTF are we paying this guy a million quid a year for? An effing monkey could do the same job.
A bonus is taxed at the same rate as normal salary. I don't think there are any benefits that come with being paid a cash bonus as opposed to a cash salary.

The only differences are the timing and the supposed arbitrary nature of the bonus.

Presuming his bonus works the usual way, he'll start with a fixed % of his salary, which will then be amended by a multiple based on some combination of his performance, business performance, share price, and any other factors considered appropriate.
Any pension implications?
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embdysman
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Hold on a wee minute here.

Yes, expectations have been lowered and yes, at times we should be investing more in the team at an earlier stage in the transfer windows. But this year we have brought players in early - Ciftic, Boyata - and as far as I could see (and many posters on KDS were in complete agreement) we had a squad that should have been more than capable of beating any other team in the CL qualifying (champions route). More than capable.

We can't hold on to our best players because of the behemoth that is the EPL on our doorstep but we have a squad that should be good enough to progress. We looked like little boys lost in the last 25 minutes against Malmo at home and then for most of the game away from home. Part of that is the manager's fault, yes, but if you can't defend at home when you are 2-0 up and then 3-1 up against an ok team from Sweden then you don't deserve to go through. When you can't header the ball, when you can't pass it 5 yards to another hooped jersey - why is that Peter Lawwell's fault?

Those boys are paid a FORTUNE to play professional football for Celtic. £500k per year and the rest. They are the envy of every young man in that stadium. They are more than good enough to win these matches but for whatever reason - mental strength, lack of motivation, fear of losing, whatever it is - we have been let down time and time again against lesser teams.

That isn't always the fault of the board of directors. We are too quick to forgive the players that are actually out on the pitch. They are better than their opponents. They are certainly better paid than their opponents.

They are letting us down all too often. Paying £10m for a striker is certainly not guaranteed to change that fact. Any board who did so would be guilty of gross negligence.
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idyllwild


pads99
9 Sep 2015, 10:28 AM
idyllwild
9 Sep 2015, 10:11 AM
murphio
9 Sep 2015, 12:30 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
A bonus is taxed at the same rate as normal salary. I don't think there are any benefits that come with being paid a cash bonus as opposed to a cash salary.

The only differences are the timing and the supposed arbitrary nature of the bonus.

Presuming his bonus works the usual way, he'll start with a fixed % of his salary, which will then be amended by a multiple based on some combination of his performance, business performance, share price, and any other factors considered appropriate.
Any pension implications?
Not normally, no. Deductions are either a fixed amount of a percentage of the salary received, and a cash bonus is treated as salary.

Shug is probably the best person to answer this definitively, he does tax stuff, though he doesn't post so much in this thread.

My take on it is that there's nothing complicated here; the bonus just has performance targets which are effin easy for Lawwell to meet. Which takes us back to Remy's point about the remuneration committee.
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Stevie67
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Corky Buczek
8 Sep 2015, 05:27 PM
*edit on dates*

Go back to season 2008/9. Much has been said about the failure to land Steven Fletcher when our strikers couldn't buy a goal.

But the malaise started in the summer of 2008 and not Jan 2009. Strachan asked for a centre half and a holding midfielder. We ended up with Crosas and Loovens and so began the now annual trawl of the fag end of the transfer market come the end of August each year .

The following year saw Mowbray hired after Owen Coyle turned us down after a botched PL negotiation. Mowbray thought he was going to get another centre half before the season started but it never materialised - a scenario that the two subsequent managers have both experienced. In all fairness a new centre half wouldn't have stopped the train wreck that was Mogga, although I have long since argued that all he did was continue in the same vein as he done with WBA the season before.

And so Neil Lennon was hired. A manager with no experience who had lost a semi final against lower division opposition - and on a salary of less than half what PL was earning. He would also have to get used to his assets being sold and then much of that money being used to cover the losses. In fairness after a sluggish start, Lenny started to win over the doubters like myself. We made CL twice - even making the last 16. Although the second time it was by the skin of our teeth.

The second CL qualification occurred after our now legendary transfer policy of wait and see as to how we progress in Europe began. It was clear during that season that Lennon was getting fed up with it. I'm not one of ones on this board that knew some of the previous coaching staff but it came as no surprise to me that Lennon packed it in when he did.

And so to Ronnie. Someone who initially was all set to be our assistant gets the top job after the likes of Roy Keane and Henrik turn us down. The idea that these two would have made good Celtic managers should set the alarm bells ringing never mind the fact we ended up with the guy who was earmarked to be their assistant.

Last summer saw shambles of a transfer window as we signed various players on loan (after the manager saying he didn't fancy such a scenario) but none in time to stop our possibly worst ever August in Europe as we were thrashed home and away by Legia and duffed by the giant that is Maribor. To go onto these games with Anthony Stokes as a lone striker really tells you all you need to now about how badly we were prepared. After a dreadful start, we seemed to find some kind of form and after - for once - a decent window in January, we had 4 in a row.

Then along comes another summer. We knew at the start that we would have to find two new centre halves as Denayer was not going to stay and this was VVD's last season. Ronnie wanted a left back and given that Guidetti was going to go and there were clearly question marks against Scepovic, we were going to need at least one probably two strikers.

So how have we done. Long term aim is for Boyata and Simovic to replace VVD and Denayer. Boyata gives you the fear on the ball and big Croat wiil take time to adjust and probably needs to toughen up if we are to believe reports, quotes and some comments from Zagreb fans. It could well be that Blackett plays at centre half for much of this season. At left back, after agreeing terms and fee for Mitchell Dijks, we then ended up with nobody. PL it seems, wants us to believe that was no other left back out there that was improvement on Charlie or Izzy - both on whom would be spectacularly bad over the two legs against Malmo.

As for the strikers, by all accounts Ronnie wanted Ciftci and we fought off Wigan for his signature. Enuff said - I suspect that will come back to haunt him. To not even bother replacing Scepovic is just negligence. As with Steven Fletcher at the start of this post, PL has rolled the dice once more and erred on the side of doing NOT enough to get by.

We currently have a Chief Exec who gets paid double what the management team does. His salary has gone on leaps and bounds whilst attendances and turnover falls and we have qualified just twice for the CL in seven seasons. In that time the likes of Braga, Utrecht, Happoel Tel Aviv, Maribor and Malmo have fed us our dinner in Europe with technicalities preventing Legia and Sion from joining that list. If you want to go back a further season in 2007/8, we finished bottom of a CL group behind Copenhagen.

In the past seven seasons, we have won 4 leagues, two league cups and two Scottish Cups. 8 trophies in total when for the past three years, there has been no real challenge. Is that good enough ? Is that enough to justify the CEO as the second highest paid person at the club ?

We hire rockie managers who blew it in Europe to begin with. I don't doubt that RD must have the finger pointed at him for getting caught on the break after 57 minutes when 2-0 up at home, but why are we hiring managers with no experience.

I'm sure that balance sheet s great but you don't need to hire a CEO on £1M a year if all you are going to do sell and rationalise the business. If you read the likes of CQN, there are those who think PL and the board are some sort of alchemists, turning raw material into gold. Well 2 visits to the CL in seven years and only eight domestic trophies in that time, really should put paid to such nonsense.

Under PL and DD we are going nowhere. If the pressure gets to much for Deila this year, then expect him to be replaced by another novice or a great former player with a chequered managerial career. They will not prepare properly for European qualifiers, That is the extent of the ambition.

If another Scottish club ever did get its act together, we would struggle because those running Celtic seem to think they are doing a great job when actually they are failing badly.
Sums things up perfectly :thumbsup:
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Flawless
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TheEvilGenius
6 Sep 2015, 06:27 PM
sevilliano
5 Sep 2015, 09:31 PM
PL is going to do his pontius pilate

RD is going to feel the heat very shortly

PL will position this as he was well supported and failed nothing more could be done - he talked the talk but couldn't walk the walk

It's actually shameful that this arrogant oaf can manoeuvre people so easily and fail time after time in his role

I actually feel sorry for RD but then again if Lennon couldn't see how he was being stitched up how could a no 2 from a small Norwegian club take him on

We live in hope that maybe one day people on the board will see pl for the ingrate tthat he is
Which is why he jumped whilst he still could.
He jumped cause he thought he could do better.

Turns out, he ended up in a club with a far worse state.

Grass isn't always greener.

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Corky Buczek
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embdysman
9 Sep 2015, 10:31 AM
Hold on a wee minute here.

Yes, expectations have been lowered and yes, at times we should be investing more in the team at an earlier stage in the transfer windows. But this year we have brought players in early - Ciftic, Boyata - and as far as I could see (and many posters on KDS were in complete agreement) we had a squad that should have been more than capable of beating any other team in the CL qualifying (champions route). More than capable.

We can't hold on to our best players because of the behemoth that is the EPL on our doorstep but we have a squad that should be good enough to progress. We looked like little boys lost in the last 25 minutes against Malmo at home and then for most of the game away from home. Part of that is the manager's fault, yes, but if you can't defend at home when you are 2-0 up and then 3-1 up against an ok team from Sweden then you don't deserve to go through. When you can't header the ball, when you can't pass it 5 yards to another hooped jersey - why is that Peter Lawwell's fault?

Those boys are paid a FORTUNE to play professional football for Celtic. £500k per year and the rest. They are the envy of every young man in that stadium. They are more than good enough to win these matches but for whatever reason - mental strength, lack of motivation, fear of losing, whatever it is - we have been let down time and time again against lesser teams.

That isn't always the fault of the board of directors. We are too quick to forgive the players that are actually out on the pitch. They are better than their opponents. They are certainly better paid than their opponents.

They are letting us down all too often. Paying £10m for a striker is certainly not guaranteed to change that fact. Any board who did so would be guilty of gross negligence.
Who is suggesting we pay £10m for a striker ? This close season is not a one off. My post covers the past seven seasons. Peter Lawwell says that he wants to finish a transfer window by being stronger than before it started. Well are we ? Is Boyata better than Denayet ? Ciftci better than Guidetti? They couldn't be bothered it would seem to replace Scepovic.

Yes there gave been times that players and managers have got it wrong but who hires the manager and buys the players ?
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Bobby Peru
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Flawless
9 Sep 2015, 10:37 AM
TheEvilGenius
6 Sep 2015, 06:27 PM
sevilliano
5 Sep 2015, 09:31 PM
PL is going to do his pontius pilate

RD is going to feel the heat very shortly

PL will position this as he was well supported and failed nothing more could be done - he talked the talk but couldn't walk the walk

It's actually shameful that this arrogant oaf can manoeuvre people so easily and fail time after time in his role

I actually feel sorry for RD but then again if Lennon couldn't see how he was being stitched up how could a no 2 from a small Norwegian club take him on

We live in hope that maybe one day people on the board will see pl for the ingrate tthat he is
Which is why he jumped whilst he still could.
He jumped cause he thought he could do better.

Turns out, he ended up in a club with a far worse state.

Grass isn't always greener.

I doubt it, i'm pretty sure he would have walked in the full knowledge his next club would be a step down from Celtic (maybe not as far down as Bolton right enough :lol: ) but he would also have known that it would be impossible to take us forward and that even to maintain the level of success of the previous couple of seasons would have been tough.
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Fearghas
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Flawless
9 Sep 2015, 10:37 AM
TheEvilGenius
6 Sep 2015, 06:27 PM
sevilliano
5 Sep 2015, 09:31 PM
PL is going to do his pontius pilate

RD is going to feel the heat very shortly

PL will position this as he was well supported and failed nothing more could be done - he talked the talk but couldn't walk the walk

It's actually shameful that this arrogant oaf can manoeuvre people so easily and fail time after time in his role

I actually feel sorry for RD but then again if Lennon couldn't see how he was being stitched up how could a no 2 from a small Norwegian club take him on

We live in hope that maybe one day people on the board will see pl for the ingrate tthat he is
Which is why he jumped whilst he still could.
He jumped cause he thought he could do better.

Turns out, he ended up in a club with a far worse state.

Grass isn't always greener.

he never "jumped" anywhere. he had no job to jump to :lol:

damn facts eh
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