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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,414,838 Views)
pauldg1
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A spray tanned Furby, eating KFC and screaming at a Gold Star family
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Van Dijk had enough glowing reports from the Netherlands to have me excited.

Simunovic has a lot of bad reports from Croatia.

These days anyone who cares to read up on it can pretty much figure out the ability level of new players who arrive. But we can't figure out how well they'll blend into the squad. Players with good pedigree can be a shampooe fit (Miku, Wakaso, Scepovic) but I can't ever recall players with poor reputations exceeding expectations when they arrived. :ph43r:

Edit: Except Mulgrew, who only turned good when we tried playing him out of position. But it's struck midnight and Charlie's pumpkin which turned into a carriage is a pumpkin again. No swear filter.
Edited by pauldg1, 3 Sep 2015, 03:17 AM.
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katlegend
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Tictical_Genius
3 Sep 2015, 01:39 AM
Taking this post from antonrogansrightboot in the transfer thread, genuinely not to single him out, belittle him or anything like that. Simply because I think it exemplifies some of the perhaps "cross-wired" thinking - for want of a better term - that I often read on here about our signings.

Quote:
 
At the risk of going all McIlvaney here, of the many qualities we love as football fans, one you can't really put a value on is hope. We all hoped we would bring in someone that would make us even remotely raise an eyebrow and go "oh aye?" but what we got was far from that.

I admit, I'm intrigued by Simunovic because of the proported price tag alone, but not much else. Allan, Christie, Ciftci... they all look decent, servicable SPFL level players. Nobody that's going to excite like Virgil did, like Victor did.

I always tell my son to wait until the end of the transfer window to get his new shirt so he can get a name on the back of it that's either new and exciting, or someone that hasn't left. I asked him this morning if he'd made his mind up what he wanted.

He said a Real Madrid shirt with Bale on it.

There's the problem we face. We have to be excited about what we watch. We have to get the kids begging to be taken to the game to see whoever it is they have on the back of their shirt that makes them WANT to be a Celtic fan.

That's the hope. This window just hasn't delivered that. It feels like another missed opportunity to kick on.

Just once, I'd like to see us have deals in place before the Champions League carry on. Good, quality, known commodities that get us excited, that improve the first team, not just bump up the squad depth.

I can but dream :/


Were we really excited by Van Dijk when he joined because he was going to excite? or was our interest piqued because he was signed for a decent fee (by our standards) and that there were some positive reports in his home countries media? How many on here had heard of him, never mind watched him play for any length of time? Looking back, how does his signing then differ from Simunovic today? other than that we didn't buy Van Dijk to replace someone we sold for a huge sum of money. Surely, we know that when we sell players for eight digit sums, that those are players who have outgrown our environment - as frustrating as that is - and we cannot replace them with anyone with the same current profile (because these players 99/100 want to move on and further themselves in better leagues).

Then there's Wanyama, I dont recall anyone being excited about him at all, a young guy signed for just under a million when we had Brown, Ledley, Commons and Ki contesting midfield positions. It's clear when we look back he came in as a nobody fighting for his chance, and left as a star player.

Our recent history is littered not only with players who we didn't really know much about or expect much from, but grew into either solid performers or star players. Going back a little further we made signings that were "blue chip", relatively high profile players that provided only sporadic levels of high performance.

When was the last time we were able to sign "Good quality, known commodities"?

In the current commercial european football landscape, we are firmly rooted as a stepping stone club. Why can there only be little, to none of that hope for the seven signings we've made this window?
Did we really make seven new signings this window? We only had one in the starting line up for our most important home game of the season, he was hopeless & a poor replacement for Denayer. Two started in Malmo ,but that was due to Lustigs injury. What we really needed were players who would come straight into the side & improve us, not more squad players. Given the standard of our team that was no big ask.
Does anybody really believe the figures being put about for Simunovic? Why would anyone pay that for a player who can't get a regular game for a side who performed worse than Celtic in Europe last season? They really think we'll believe anything.
Some will right enough.

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Jinkyfan67
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guinness07
2 Sep 2015, 10:19 PM
Well..just got back to the real world after nightshifts. Totally underf***ingwhelmed once again.
I s Dermott Desmond cash rich or just on paper. personally, I think his wealth is "off the radar"
Was anticipating a PL home produced video by now. don't think I could bring myself to watch anymore of his sh++e
sick to death of this Bored (not this board the Celtic Bored)
My wee bhoy was back to his 1st day of school today, came home with a consent form for a trip to Celtic(again) in November.
getting no more money out of me PL. If you wont spend, neither will I.

Here we go...10 in a row balance sheet champions.
Expecting Desmond to dip into his personal fortune (AGAIN) is pathetic and hun-like. We spend what we earn as should be the case with every football club
in the world . Desmond financed some of our greatest seasons under MON and got his cash back as he had every right to expect!
I'm damn sure Lawwell would like to be spending 20 million every window and have us all fawning over him and kissing his feet but he has to work with what he has

When Lawwell leaves Celtic he'll get a plum EPL job! Doubt if there's many others at CP that would!
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JonnyB67
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Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 08:20 AM
guinness07
2 Sep 2015, 10:19 PM
Well..just got back to the real world after nightshifts. Totally underf***ingwhelmed once again.
I s Dermott Desmond cash rich or just on paper. personally, I think his wealth is "off the radar"
Was anticipating a PL home produced video by now. don't think I could bring myself to watch anymore of his sh++e
sick to death of this Bored (not this board the Celtic Bored)
My wee bhoy was back to his 1st day of school today, came home with a consent form for a trip to Celtic(again) in November.
getting no more money out of me PL. If you wont spend, neither will I.

Here we go...10 in a row balance sheet champions.
Expecting Desmond to dip into his personal fortune (AGAIN) is pathetic and hun-like. We spend what we earn as should be the case with every football club
in the world . Desmond financed some of our greatest seasons under MON and got his cash back as he had every right to expect!
I'm damn sure Lawwell would like to be spending 20 million every window and have us all fawning over him and kissing his feet but he has to work with what he has

When Lawwell leaves Celtic he'll get a plum EPL job! Doubt if there's many others at CP that would!
Nobody is expecting us to go and spend silly money. I think most of us question the transfer policy. How much have we spent on absolute dross? Lawwell has far too much say over transfers.

He needs to go.
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katlegend
First-team starter
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Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 08:20 AM
guinness07
2 Sep 2015, 10:19 PM
Well..just got back to the real world after nightshifts. Totally underf***ingwhelmed once again.
I s Dermott Desmond cash rich or just on paper. personally, I think his wealth is "off the radar"
Was anticipating a PL home produced video by now. don't think I could bring myself to watch anymore of his sh++e
sick to death of this Bored (not this board the Celtic Bored)
My wee bhoy was back to his 1st day of school today, came home with a consent form for a trip to Celtic(again) in November.
getting no more money out of me PL. If you wont spend, neither will I.

Here we go...10 in a row balance sheet champions.
Expecting Desmond to dip into his personal fortune (AGAIN) is pathetic and hun-like. We spend what we earn as should be the case with every football club
in the world . Desmond financed some of our greatest seasons under MON and got his cash back as he had every right to expect!
I'm damn sure Lawwell would like to be spending 20 million every window and have us all fawning over him and kissing his feet but he has to work with what he has

When Lawwell leaves Celtic he'll get a plum EPL job! Doubt if there's many others at CP that would!
See the £70m of extra income accumulated in 2 years from two successive spells in CL & the sales of Hooper,Wanyama & Forster how much of that was used to strengthen our football team?
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Quiet Assasin
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Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 08:20 AM
guinness07
2 Sep 2015, 10:19 PM
Well..just got back to the real world after nightshifts. Totally underf***ingwhelmed once again.
I s Dermott Desmond cash rich or just on paper. personally, I think his wealth is "off the radar"
Was anticipating a PL home produced video by now. don't think I could bring myself to watch anymore of his sh++e
sick to death of this Bored (not this board the Celtic Bored)
My wee bhoy was back to his 1st day of school today, came home with a consent form for a trip to Celtic(again) in November.
getting no more money out of me PL. If you wont spend, neither will I.

Here we go...10 in a row balance sheet champions.
Expecting Desmond to dip into his personal fortune (AGAIN) is pathetic and hun-like. We spend what we earn as should be the case with every football club
in the world . Desmond financed some of our greatest seasons under MON and got his cash back as he had every right to expect!
I'm damn sure Lawwell would like to be spending 20 million every window and have us all fawning over him and kissing his feet but he has to work with what he has

When Lawwell leaves Celtic he'll get a plum EPL job! Doubt if there's many others at CP that would!
The ones that would, already have.

We can't afford Premiership level wages but Lawwell has a Premiership salary for doing very, very little. If we're selling all our players to the EPL maybe he should go join them.

Fergus McCann - famous for his supposed parsimony - spent £16m in the 1997/98 season (when adjusted for inflation). Not many football clubs have had a real terms cut in spending like that.
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stibhan
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Viva la Quinta Brigada
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Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 08:20 AM
guinness07
2 Sep 2015, 10:19 PM
Well..just got back to the real world after nightshifts. Totally underf***ingwhelmed once again.
I s Dermott Desmond cash rich or just on paper. personally, I think his wealth is "off the radar"
Was anticipating a PL home produced video by now. don't think I could bring myself to watch anymore of his sh++e
sick to death of this Bored (not this board the Celtic Bored)
My wee bhoy was back to his 1st day of school today, came home with a consent form for a trip to Celtic(again) in November.
getting no more money out of me PL. If you wont spend, neither will I.

Here we go...10 in a row balance sheet champions.
Expecting Desmond to dip into his personal fortune (AGAIN) is pathetic and hun-like. We spend what we earn as should be the case with every football club
in the world . Desmond financed some of our greatest seasons under MON and got his cash back as he had every right to expect!
I'm damn sure Lawwell would like to be spending 20 million every window and have us all fawning over him and kissing his feet but he has to work with what he has

When Lawwell leaves Celtic he'll get a plum EPL job! Doubt if there's many others at CP that would!
There is no way that Desmond bought shares in Celtic as an investment, or if he did, he would have put us on the market by now. He isn't that stupid.

Lawwell would get a 'plum EPL' job but why bother? He gets paid far more than any chief executive outside the top five or six in England. And he isn't getting one of those jobs.
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Rodan
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"This thread is well Gammon" - shugmc
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Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 08:20 AM
guinness07
2 Sep 2015, 10:19 PM
Well..just got back to the real world after nightshifts. Totally underf***ingwhelmed once again.
I s Dermott Desmond cash rich or just on paper. personally, I think his wealth is "off the radar"
Was anticipating a PL home produced video by now. don't think I could bring myself to watch anymore of his sh++e
sick to death of this Bored (not this board the Celtic Bored)
My wee bhoy was back to his 1st day of school today, came home with a consent form for a trip to Celtic(again) in November.
getting no more money out of me PL. If you wont spend, neither will I.

Here we go...10 in a row balance sheet champions.
Expecting Desmond to dip into his personal fortune (AGAIN) is pathetic and hun-like. We spend what we earn as should be the case with every football club
in the world . Desmond financed some of our greatest seasons under MON and got his cash back as he had every right to expect!
I'm damn sure Lawwell would like to be spending 20 million every window and have us all fawning over him and kissing his feet but he has to work with what he has

When Lawwell leaves Celtic he'll get a plum EPL job! Doubt if there's many others at CP that would!
Lawwell hasn't "work(ed) with what he has" for years.
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bubba
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Getting on a bit
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stibhan
3 Sep 2015, 08:48 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 08:20 AM
guinness07
2 Sep 2015, 10:19 PM
Well..just got back to the real world after nightshifts. Totally underf***ingwhelmed once again.
I s Dermott Desmond cash rich or just on paper. personally, I think his wealth is "off the radar"
Was anticipating a PL home produced video by now. don't think I could bring myself to watch anymore of his sh++e
sick to death of this Bored (not this board the Celtic Bored)
My wee bhoy was back to his 1st day of school today, came home with a consent form for a trip to Celtic(again) in November.
getting no more money out of me PL. If you wont spend, neither will I.

Here we go...10 in a row balance sheet champions.
Expecting Desmond to dip into his personal fortune (AGAIN) is pathetic and hun-like. We spend what we earn as should be the case with every football club
in the world . Desmond financed some of our greatest seasons under MON and got his cash back as he had every right to expect!
I'm damn sure Lawwell would like to be spending 20 million every window and have us all fawning over him and kissing his feet but he has to work with what he has

When Lawwell leaves Celtic he'll get a plum EPL job! Doubt if there's many others at CP that would!
There is no way that Desmond bought shares in Celtic as an investment, or if he did, he would have put us on the market by now. He isn't that stupid.

Lawwell would get a 'plum EPL' job but why bother? He gets paid far more than any chief executive outside the top five or six in England. And he isn't getting one of those jobs.
Arsenal wanted him

He'd have been perfect there working with a manager who doesn't want to spend money
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Jinkyfan67
Occasional Substitute
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katlegend
3 Sep 2015, 08:29 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 08:20 AM
guinness07
2 Sep 2015, 10:19 PM
Well..just got back to the real world after nightshifts. Totally underf***ingwhelmed once again.
I s Dermott Desmond cash rich or just on paper. personally, I think his wealth is "off the radar"
Was anticipating a PL home produced video by now. don't think I could bring myself to watch anymore of his sh++e
sick to death of this Bored (not this board the Celtic Bored)
My wee bhoy was back to his 1st day of school today, came home with a consent form for a trip to Celtic(again) in November.
getting no more money out of me PL. If you wont spend, neither will I.

Here we go...10 in a row balance sheet champions.
Expecting Desmond to dip into his personal fortune (AGAIN) is pathetic and hun-like. We spend what we earn as should be the case with every football club
in the world . Desmond financed some of our greatest seasons under MON and got his cash back as he had every right to expect!
I'm damn sure Lawwell would like to be spending 20 million every window and have us all fawning over him and kissing his feet but he has to work with what he has

When Lawwell leaves Celtic he'll get a plum EPL job! Doubt if there's many others at CP that would!
See the £70m of extra income accumulated in 2 years from two successive spells in CL & the sales of Hooper,Wanyama & Forster how much of that was used to strengthen our football team?
It was used for the benefit of Celtic their employees and their fans -
If not expect to see another fracas at the sherriff court sometime soon !
I dont know why people refuse to accept that Money in -Money out is there to be seen in our (Audited) accounts!!
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Franakamura
First-team captain
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Gerinho
2 Sep 2015, 08:33 PM
If mulgrew makes the starting 11 or comes on from the bench on a saturday, he earns £17k pw. Heard this from someone who knows him well.

If he does get a new deal i sincerely hope that salary is slashed significantly.
I wouldn't look too much into this, can't see Mulgrew discussing specifics of his deal with anyone out with his wife.
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Chronic town
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the unseen hand
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Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:03 AM
katlegend
3 Sep 2015, 08:29 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 08:20 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
See the £70m of extra income accumulated in 2 years from two successive spells in CL & the sales of Hooper,Wanyama & Forster how much of that was used to strengthen our football team?
It was used for the benefit of Celtic their employees and their fans -
If not expect to see another fracas at the sherriff court sometime soon !
I dont know why people refuse to accept that Money in -Money out is there to be seen in our (Audited) accounts!!
You can't use the liquidation of Rangers to swat away underinvestment and excruciatingly bad player recruitment at Celtic.

Won't wash.
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Jinkyfan67
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Chronic town
3 Sep 2015, 09:10 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:03 AM
katlegend
3 Sep 2015, 08:29 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
It was used for the benefit of Celtic their employees and their fans -
If not expect to see another fracas at the sherriff court sometime soon !
I dont know why people refuse to accept that Money in -Money out is there to be seen in our (Audited) accounts!!
You can't use the liquidation of Rangers to swat away underinvestment and excruciatingly bad player recruitment at Celtic.

Won't wash.
I'll accept speculative and "bad player recruitment" .. Yes definitely but
how can we be accused of "underinvestment" when we spend pretty much all we get ??
Just baffling that clearly intelligent people refuse to accept that!!
Edited by Jinkyfan67, 3 Sep 2015, 09:23 AM.
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Chronic town
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the unseen hand
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Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:16 AM
Chronic town
3 Sep 2015, 09:10 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:03 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
You can't use the liquidation of Rangers to swat away underinvestment and excruciatingly bad player recruitment at Celtic.

Won't wash.
I'll accept speculative and "bad player recruitment" in players.. Yes definitely but
how can we be accused of "underinvestment" when we spend pretty much all we get ??
Just baffling that clearly intelligent people refuse to accept that!!
I'd say underinvestment is represented by having Griffiths, Stokes, and Ciftci (suspended) as your striking options in your most important, money-spinning tie of the whole season. While playing an untried youngster at right back, and a mediocre utility man on the other side.

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henrikisgod
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Considering retirement
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Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:16 AM
Chronic town
3 Sep 2015, 09:10 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:03 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
You can't use the liquidation of Rangers to swat away underinvestment and excruciatingly bad player recruitment at Celtic.

Won't wash.
I'll accept speculative and "bad player recruitment" .. Yes definitely but
how can we be accused of "underinvestment" when we spend pretty much all we get ??
Just baffling that clearly intelligent people refuse to accept that!!
I wouldn't say it's underinvestment that annoys me, it's the strategy itself

Spend a few hundred thousand each on 3 or 4 players in the hope that you can sell them on for a profit rather than spend a reasonable amount to get a proven player to strengthen the squad and KEEP him

I'm not advocating spending outwith our means, just ensuring a decent level of football, after all we pay to be entertained and if we're not it will have an affect on crowds and revenue
It's a vicious circle
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dazabhoy67
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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katlegend
3 Sep 2015, 08:29 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 08:20 AM
guinness07
2 Sep 2015, 10:19 PM
Well..just got back to the real world after nightshifts. Totally underf***ingwhelmed once again.
I s Dermott Desmond cash rich or just on paper. personally, I think his wealth is "off the radar"
Was anticipating a PL home produced video by now. don't think I could bring myself to watch anymore of his sh++e
sick to death of this Bored (not this board the Celtic Bored)
My wee bhoy was back to his 1st day of school today, came home with a consent form for a trip to Celtic(again) in November.
getting no more money out of me PL. If you wont spend, neither will I.

Here we go...10 in a row balance sheet champions.
Expecting Desmond to dip into his personal fortune (AGAIN) is pathetic and hun-like. We spend what we earn as should be the case with every football club
in the world . Desmond financed some of our greatest seasons under MON and got his cash back as he had every right to expect!
I'm damn sure Lawwell would like to be spending 20 million every window and have us all fawning over him and kissing his feet but he has to work with what he has

When Lawwell leaves Celtic he'll get a plum EPL job! Doubt if there's many others at CP that would!
See the £70m of extra income accumulated in 2 years from two successive spells in CL & the sales of Hooper,Wanyama & Forster how much of that was used to strengthen our football team?
I was speaking to another fan yesterday who said out of the 70 million we have made we have spent 42 million?

I didnt have the time to go add up all our transfer fees but surely thats nowhere near right?
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One sharp cookie
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Getting on a bit
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Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:16 AM
Chronic town
3 Sep 2015, 09:10 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:03 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
You can't use the liquidation of Rangers to swat away underinvestment and excruciatingly bad player recruitment at Celtic.

Won't wash.
I'll accept speculative and "bad player recruitment" .. Yes definitely but
how can we be accused of "underinvestment" when we spend pretty much all we get ??
Just baffling that clearly intelligent people refuse to accept that!!
You say we "spend what we get". I've heard this mentioned before but what some people fail to appreciate is that if we speculated to accumulate, we'd potentially "get" a lot more to begin with. A case in point; Southampton decided to push the boat out a couple of years ago and spend a club record £12 million on Victor Wanyama. This summer, they have been knocking back bids from Spurs for almost double that. If Southampton, two years ago, had instead decided to play it safe and spend £1.5 million on a holding midfielder rather than £12 million, what do you think the chances would be of that player attracting bids in excess of £20 million two years later? The Southampton model of "buy high, sell higher" is something many of us would like to see Celtic replicate to a certain extent. It doesn't have to be done recklessly.
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lubolubo
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One sharp cookie
3 Sep 2015, 09:48 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:16 AM
Chronic town
3 Sep 2015, 09:10 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I'll accept speculative and "bad player recruitment" .. Yes definitely but
how can we be accused of "underinvestment" when we spend pretty much all we get ??
Just baffling that clearly intelligent people refuse to accept that!!
You say we "spend what we get". I've heard this mentioned before but what some people fail to appreciate is that if we speculated to accumulate, we'd potentially "get" a lot more to begin with. A case in point; Southampton decided to push the boat out a couple of years ago and spend a club record £12 million on Victor Wanyama. This summer, they have been knocking back bids from Spurs for almost double that. If Southampton, two years ago, had instead decided to play it safe and spend £1.5 million on a holding midfielder rather than £12 million, what do you think the chances would be of that player attracting bids in excess of £20 million two years later? The Southampton model of "buy high, sell higher" is something many of us would like to see Celtic replicate to a certain extent. It doesn't have to be done recklessly.
There's a limit to what you can get for a player from the SPFL. Wanyama pretty much couldn't have had a better CL season with us and he topped out at £12 million. We weren't getting £20 million for him coming from playing in Scotland absent additional validation of his ability at a major international competition.

We're now a stepping stone for young foreign players wanting to get on the radar of premiership clubs. Sad but true, at the first sign of concrete interest from the Premiership most of our players will agitate to leave. Premiership clubs will spend ridiculous amounts for players proved in that league, and for young English talent from the Championship, but there seems to be a limit to what they'll pay from players from minor leagues. We play in a minor league.

We can spend £5 million on a player, but we're not going to be selling him for much more than a Victor or Van Dijk.
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henrikisgod
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lubolubo
3 Sep 2015, 10:21 AM
We can spend £5 million on a player, but we're not going to be selling him for much more than a Victor or Van Dijk.
Sums the whole sorry situation up for me


Remember the days when we signed a player because he would strengthen our squad?
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Stephane_Mahe
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lubolubo
3 Sep 2015, 10:21 AM
One sharp cookie
3 Sep 2015, 09:48 AM
Jinkyfan67
3 Sep 2015, 09:16 AM

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You say we "spend what we get". I've heard this mentioned before but what some people fail to appreciate is that if we speculated to accumulate, we'd potentially "get" a lot more to begin with. A case in point; Southampton decided to push the boat out a couple of years ago and spend a club record £12 million on Victor Wanyama. This summer, they have been knocking back bids from Spurs for almost double that. If Southampton, two years ago, had instead decided to play it safe and spend £1.5 million on a holding midfielder rather than £12 million, what do you think the chances would be of that player attracting bids in excess of £20 million two years later? The Southampton model of "buy high, sell higher" is something many of us would like to see Celtic replicate to a certain extent. It doesn't have to be done recklessly.
There's a limit to what you can get for a player from the SPFL. Wanyama pretty much couldn't have had a better CL season with us and he topped out at £12 million. We weren't getting £20 million for him coming from playing in Scotland absent additional validation of his ability at a major international competition.

We're now a stepping stone for young foreign players wanting to get on the radar of premiership clubs. Sad but true, at the first sign of concrete interest from the Premiership most of our players will agitate to leave. Premiership clubs will spend ridiculous amounts for players proved in that league, and for young English talent from the Championship, but there seems to be a limit to what they'll pay from players from minor leagues. We play in a minor league.

We can spend £5 million on a player, but we're not going to be selling him for much more than a Victor or Van Dijk.
I agree with that.

Why we should be spending more money is to give us a better chance of getting into the CL and all the money that comes with that.

If we had spent £2m - £3m on any of two from centre half, defensive mid, attacking mid and strikers, we would have had, in theory at least, a much better chance of getting into the CL.

If guys at that level come in and do well, you can guarantee they're off to England in 2 years time. What they would give us is a vastly increased chance of getting to the CL and even if we only made it once over the two years they were here, it'd still be worth it financially, even if they left for free never mind any transfer fee we might get for them.

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