Celtic Database at thecelticwiki.com
All
Celtic
World Cup 2018
Tickets/Travel
Wiki
General
Sport
F&D
Entertainment
Travel
Tipsters
Tech
| Welcome to Kerrydale Street. We hope you enjoy your visit. You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you decide to register, please be aware that we don't accept email addresses from free web accounts like gmail, Hotmail, live.co.uk etc. Sorry, but almost all of the abuse and spam that we get is from free web accounts. The software on the forum will automatically block any requests using a free email account. Upon Registration, you will be given access to all our varied Forums, and you will be expected to comply with our fairly stringent Rules and Regulations. Meantime, enjoy your visit If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features: |
| The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM | |
|---|---|
| Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,414,872 Views) | |
| Ned Rise | 26 Aug 2015, 10:06 AM Post #3001 |
|
These boots were made for hunbustin'
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
The policy doesn't work. We are a club of serial gamblers. We gambled against Karagandy and a last minute goal saw us through. But for the width of our crossbar we'd have been out. So the next year we gamble again on an unproven manager. This time it's even worse, because when we get utterly ripped to shreds, we land a get out of jail free card. Inexplicably, the team isn't strengthened and we go out again. We then scramble on transfer deadline day getting in strikers because the ones we have evidently aren't good enough. So, where are those strikers today. One was a loan and one is nowhere to be seen. We have however 'bolstered' our frontline with yet another signing from Dundee Utd. If anyone looked at Dundee Utd last season and thought that taking a third of their team would be way forward, they'd have been in a minority of four or five people. Yet here we are. Last night, two were benched and one was subbed. We have a strategy of buying Scottish players. Nothing wrong with that except Scotland aren't very good. Of the six who started last night, one of them is a regular for Scotland and one used to be before he was injured. Celtic made over £20M in the Champions League post Karagandy. Was it wisely invested? Is the team any better today than it was then? Not qualifying for the CL has cost Celtic at least £40M this year and last. This means we have to sell our players and replace them with those of a lower standard. This means more gambles. More Pukkis, Baldes, Boerrigters, Ciftcis, Boyatas, more loan deals of players who haven't ever played competitive games of football or who have been out with career threatening injuries. We sold Forster for £10M and got Gordon. It was a gamble that paid off. Had it been like the majority of those other gambles, a failure, we'd have seen Zaluska in goals for us last year. Year on year, the quality is drained, yet year on year the illusion is sold that the team is getting better and the club is moving forward. It's like the optical illusion of the wheels on a car seemingly spinning backwards while the car is moving forwards. In our case, the wheels appear to be spinning forward. So the managers, Lennon and Deila, have both been sold short. There's no question of that. However, last night showed once again that this isn't the only problem at the club. We had control of the game at Celtic Park and failed to close out a reasonably comfortable lead. That said, Malmo would have got the result last night whether they needed one goal, or two, and maybe even three. Celtic under Deila are mentally weak. We went into the game last night in control of the situation. We were winning before the ball was kicked. Even at half time we only needed one goal, but by then it was evident the gig was up. Against Inverness, we also had a ridiculously bad decision go against us, but we were winning the game when we came out in the second half, 11 v 11 and then proceed to baws it up. We were in control of the tie against Maribor, having taken the lead over there and, in the home game, still in a winning position with 20 minutes to go. As in many cases, our substitutions were disastrous and handed the tie to them. I like Ronny. He's a likeable guy and I like the ideal of a Celtic side playing fast, attacking, pressing football. But a goal in the last minute is as good as a goal in the first minute. If we're blowing out our arses after an hour, as we were last week, then there is little point in playing a game at an intensity that our players can't last the full 90 minutes at. Inverness finished stronger than us (just because we went down to 10 men doesn't mean we should fold like a cheap deckchair) and Malmo played at an intensity for 90 minutes last night that we simply aren't capable of doing ourselves. Maybe we thought we'd simply beat them because they were Swedish and we usually beat Swedish teams. It wouldn't be surprising as it's the kind of complacency that haunts Celtic. In the end, they wanted it more. They dug in at Celtic Park and for an hour they looked the more able and likely side. If the manager can't get his team to play as if they want it then we've got a problem. His team selection seemed to me like there are loud voices in the dressing room who didn't want Ambrose or Izzy picked. The manager played an untried defence in the most important game of the season. Whether he was listening to people in the dressing room, or whether he made the decision of his own accord, his bottle crashed. Subsequently the team's bottle crashed. We were unlucky with the goal last night, an appalling decision, but we have the ref to thank for not sending of any number of our players last night and so leading to further embarrassment. I'm afraid I don't think Ronny has it. However, does he get the players he wants? Was it his choice to sell Berget (on the performance in the two legs you could say it's the kind of bruising performer that we have indeed lacked) or did Lawwell decide he wasn't cutting it and let him go? Did he want to sell Matthews, leaving him with the right back dilemma he had last night, where he ended up playing a rookie who has made one start for us? Ultimately, if he goes, who's there to replace him? Who wants to be at a club which buys five suits from Oxfam and hopes one is wearable after a dry clean, rather than just putting the money together and buying, for want of a better phrase, a nice, sharp suit? In the end, Celtic are not anymore in the business of building a team. They are in the business of managing expectations while selling the best players off a stuttering conveyor belt. Celtic in the last 4-5 seasons has had the makings of a top side. Yet we sell the forwards to finance the defence, leaving us with no forwards worthy of the jersey. Or we have holes in the defence that our decent forward line struggles to cover for. We've had a strong spine, from goalkeeper through central defence, midfield and up front. Regrettably, they never all played at the same time and, even more regrettably, those who have the power to make it happen have no interest in doing so. Enjoy your £1M bonus, Peter, enjoy the Bahamas, Dermot. Send us a postcard with the next phase of the strategy on the back. |
![]() |
|
| MILLIGANS ISLAND | 26 Aug 2015, 10:09 AM Post #3002 |
|
....give us a glimmer......
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
For me the risks being taken by the board are understandable ones, the level of money being invested is about right to give us a good chance of qualification, but where it's falling down is we are making poor signings and the manager is making the same mistakes again and again in europe. I'll say it again - if the likes of bate,malmo and tel aviv can qualify without huge levels of investment then why can't we ? The boards strategy looks to me to be the correct one. The buck stops with deila and the players who once again did not perform in a key game. |
![]() |
|
| green_equals_silver | 26 Aug 2015, 10:09 AM Post #3003 |
|
Bobinho9
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
|
![]() |
|
| fatboab | 26 Aug 2015, 10:12 AM Post #3004 |
|
Just before the Dawn
![]()
|
I mentioned last night about our "parallel decline", and it is blindingly obvious to anyone who cares to look that in the years since the huns liquidation, our downsizing has gathered apace. This need not have happened, in fact we should have opened the gap to a level where we became untouchable, but Lawwell, Bankier et al have been blindsided by domestic dominance in the SPL. Worryingly, our Chairman last week, in the aftermath of the first game, seemed content with the notion of Europa Cup football beyond Christmas. I guess that attitude permeated the entire Board. In any industry/business, it is self defeating to have the same man at the helm for too long. Complacency sets in, cliques are formed, and new ideas are in short supply. We need change throughout the club , from the Board and the Scouting set up, to the transfer policy and the ambition to succeed where we are currently failing ( and seemingly accepting that failure) Lawwell should stand down. He has made enough from Celtic to live a very nice life, and he won't be short of offers from elsewhere. The idea that he is " a fan like you and me" actually makes me sick. |
![]() |
|
| paddysloan | 26 Aug 2015, 10:12 AM Post #3005 |
|
Much posting, such opinion, very controversial. wow.
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
|
![]() |
|
| adl | 26 Aug 2015, 10:19 AM Post #3006 |
|
First team training
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
The Celtic board measures the club's progress against the "Rangers" brand. Sadly, that's how it is and always will be. When the huns finally went bust in 2012, they set about reducing the wage bill and debt to more 'sustainable' levels in the full knowledge that the replacement club at Ibrox would eventually have to play catch-up with next to no money. The CL windfalls in 2012 and 2013 were unexpected bonuses given that Neil Lennon was a relatively inexperienced manager - it's allowed them to put in place a financial model where Europa League football is 'good enough'. Edited by adl, 26 Aug 2015, 10:22 AM.
|
![]() |
|
| green_equals_silver | 26 Aug 2015, 10:20 AM Post #3007 |
|
Bobinho9
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Genuinely hope that Aberdeen and/or Hearts go on a sustained run to really put the scheidters up the board |
![]() |
|
| Farkakt AlteKaker | 26 Aug 2015, 10:44 AM Post #3008 |
|
Crowded elevators smell different to midgets
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Pistol Pete needs turn the gun on himself! We need shake up from top to bottom! |
![]() |
|
| jebus82 | 26 Aug 2015, 10:49 AM Post #3009 |
|
Nanananana Andy Halliday.....ANDY HALLIDAAAAY!!
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
We have no stars, We have no heroes, We always take the safe option with transfers. We have been downsized to the stage where a team from the swedish league has easily knocked us out. People will point out we have a playing budget higher than Malmo and Maribor but we dont use it correctly. They have a solid core of players and have stretched their budget/gambled on 1 or 2 players to complement their squad, rosenberg for malmo and tavares for maribor being 2, they have both scored to put us out. Our highest paid player has no influence on games at european level and very rarely wins us games. The problem we have is we take zero risks with our signings, we have a squad of 20+ who are all cheap, easy, potential filled options, if 1 out of 5 develop we are doing well. We should have a squad of 12-15 potential filled cheap signings complimented by 3 or 4 bigger star signings and use youth to fill in the gaps in the squad. But we dont as we wont sign the 3 guys who want 25K+ as we always want the safe option. If our board were on masterchef we would serve up porridge as its cheap and easy and hope everyone else burnt their food. I know people will want to blame our manager(s) but its the boards actions and policies that have got us here, our previous manager walked because of this, and a fair few knocked us back because of this. Until the board change strategy we will keep going backwards and dare i say, it but i cant see us qualifying for the group stages again under this strategy. Sadly they see us as a business first and a football club second and being slightly better than Aberdeen is viewed as success. Edited by jebus82, 26 Aug 2015, 10:50 AM.
|
![]() |
|
| are you here for the game boys | 26 Aug 2015, 10:50 AM Post #3010 |
![]()
Everyone's Fantasy Football first pick
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
This has always been my concern. We had a great opportunity with not a huge amount of investment to ensure CL qualification for the past few years. That would have reaped considerable financial rewards and in turn allowed us to strengthen the team. In case the CEO forgets the team is what we follow not a balance sheet. We failed to invest when it was needed and have paid the penalty. If our CEO's ambition is just to keep ahead of Sevco then that is not acceptable. He is on record as saying we only look at ourselves and what we do (I'm paraphrasing)- that is just not correct. The club needs overhauled from top to bottom. The strategy of buying projects is no longer working. After VVD who else is there to flog off? The complete inability of our scouting staff to identify a striker is mind-blowing. The manager also needs to have a good look at himself. The Academy in particular needs to be looked at- we have the highest budget in Scotland but are producing nothing. That is just not acceptable. |
![]() |
|
| donegal67 | 26 Aug 2015, 10:55 AM Post #3011 |
|
Club Captain
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Field all to ourselves and a chance of 20 million for reaching champions league every year and we downsize and sell our best players every year smacks of lack of ambition to me |
![]() |
|
| lennoxlegend | 26 Aug 2015, 10:58 AM Post #3012 |
|
Youth team player
![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Pedro is a Celtic man...if he moves who do you bring in...last nights shambles lies fairly and squarely with coaches and players...if we cant defend corners against an ordinary team like Malmo then we don't deserve to be in c.l...zonal marking?...not for me...deila deserves more time but he frustrates me sometimes with his moves...armstrong was playing Pk and Kris did nothing...butit took lemny three goes to get to c.i. So Ronny should het another and pedro needs to give him decent money for decent defenders ....Lennoxlegend. |
![]() |
|
| SwavBhoy | 26 Aug 2015, 11:03 AM Post #3013 |
|
Getting on a bit
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Aye mate......nae bother.......all hail Peter |
![]() |
|
| ronny_is_not_da_man | 26 Aug 2015, 11:06 AM Post #3014 |
|
Off treasure hunting in Holland
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Are we to believe that we can't risk a little debt to get a better quality of player? You cover that risk by CL qualification and if you have better players they are likely to be sold for more than we bought them for. |
![]() |
|
| Midfield Maestro | 26 Aug 2015, 11:06 AM Post #3015 |
![]()
Retired and now a BT Sports pundit
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
The warning signs were there with Karagandy. And they were certainly there with Legia and Maribor. We have now, in three seasons and with four attempts, only qualified once (just) for the Champions League through the champions route. There is clearly a problem of strategy. I don't think it has really been a case of lack of investment; it has been a case of poor investment (i.e. wasting lots of money on poor players). The problem is that our squad has now atrophied to a point where major investment is probably needed if we are to qualify next season. Major investment isn't going to be funded by Europa League football. Edited by Midfield Maestro, 26 Aug 2015, 11:07 AM.
|
![]() |
|
| harryhoodshatrick | 26 Aug 2015, 11:11 AM Post #3016 |
|
Everyone's Fantasy Football first pick
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Of course we can afford to go into a little debt.However if we had spent the money on a quality striker to replace hooper we would have spent a lot less than the amount of £1M-£2m players we wasted on players clearly not good enough.Spending cheaply can sometimes be a false economy. |
![]() |
|
| tinsoldier | 26 Aug 2015, 11:14 AM Post #3017 |
|
Older than dirt
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
So the blame lies with the coaches and players but Pedro ( ) needs to give the manager more money? |
![]() |
|
| jebus82 | 26 Aug 2015, 11:14 AM Post #3018 |
|
Nanananana Andy Halliday.....ANDY HALLIDAAAAY!!
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
the old analogy of "buy cheap, buy twice" seems made for us
|
![]() |
|
| tinsoldier | 26 Aug 2015, 11:25 AM Post #3019 |
|
Older than dirt
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Perhaps the message will get through to the board should there be a poor take-up of Europa League tickets. The again perhaps not. |
![]() |
|
| the_cannelloni_of_charisma | 26 Aug 2015, 11:27 AM Post #3020 |
|
First-team captain
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Some good posts, it's a shame that what's said in here won't make a difference. I can understand that we should live within our means and that some of Celtic's problems are a victim of circumstance. However the points about the board spending more shrewdly still apply. We have lost our best players like Hooper, Forster, Ki, Wanyama. Even Ledley and Samaras are big losses compared to our current squad. We have replaced with more and more gambles and we seem to be running out of top players. No one in the youth ranks is standing out and our transfer targets are non existent. We could have easily made the champions league this year if we had spent better last season. We will not make the Champions League again whilst the board continue with their existing structure. |
![]() |
|
| 1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous) | |
|
|
| Go to Next Page | |
| « Previous Topic · Celtic Football Club Discussion Forum · Next Topic » |





![]](http://z5.ifrm.com/static/1/pip_r.png)






) needs to give the manager more money?

8:49 AM Jul 11