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The Board - general discussion (including Res 12); notes from the AGM
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Topic Started: 15 Jul 2014, 12:03 AM (1,414,921 Views)
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Luxo
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29 Aug 2014, 01:51 PM
Post #2041
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- Neil Jung
- 29 Aug 2014, 12:38 PM
Or the many fitness experts who have oversaw a deteriotian in the fitness of the first team squad since Strachan's time in charge. This is an interesting point - and I just want to make a wee observation for anyone who isn't aware.
Do you remember the big baldy guy who was the fitness coach under O'Neil? He was that the club for many years, and followed O'Neil to Villa and Sunderland - Scottish guy, he was very highly rated. he came from (i think) a wrestling background? I don't remember his name, but i remember when he was at Villa, O'Neil gave him carte blanche to go off around the world attending seminars etc, in order to make Villa's fitness regime the best.
I am sure he left us ewarly in Strachan's tenure.
He is now, bizarrely, fitness coach for the huns.
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murphio
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29 Aug 2014, 01:52 PM
Post #2042
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Could start a row in an empty room
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- Bawman
- 29 Aug 2014, 12:50 PM
- tinsoldier
- 29 Aug 2014, 12:44 PM
- Bawman
- 29 Aug 2014, 12:41 PM
Lawwell is an employee. He is doing his employers bidding. Get rid of Lawwell all ye like, they'll just employ somebody else.
Then it requires new control at the very top. A new owner. How likely Is that to happen?
Therein is the real issue. I said it before, we have a boardroom of chessplayers not poker players. We are not in the business of football, we are in the business of business. We are out to continue to generate profit, be that in the CL, Europa, selling players etc as long as we generate a profit year on year. People might not like Lawwell but that's partly why he's paid the way he is. He's a figurehead, a barrier to those that make policy at Celtic. He implements policy. He has far more power and influence than you credit him with. People argue he is just doing Desmond's bidding and if that is the case why are we paying him 1m per year if all he is doing is implementing someone else's policies? The direction we took post Martin O'Neill was down to Lawwell. He assumed responsibility for the football department and Strachan, unlike his predecessor, reported directly to him. It was he who sidelined Ray Clarke and hired John Park. It is he who has final say in wage negotiations and player recruitment. He deserves a lot of credit for the period post Mowbray but he has royally effed up regenerating the team he helped build.
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Ron Swanson
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29 Aug 2014, 01:56 PM
Post #2043
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First name on the team-sheet
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- Luxo
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:51 PM
- Neil Jung
- 29 Aug 2014, 12:38 PM
Or the many fitness experts who have oversaw a deteriotian in the fitness of the first team squad since Strachan's time in charge.
This is an interesting point - and I just want to make a wee observation for anyone who isn't aware. Do you remember the big baldy guy who was the fitness coach under O'Neil? He was that the club for many years, and followed O'Neil to Villa and Sunderland - Scottish guy, he was very highly rated. he came from (i think) a wrestling background? I don't remember his name, but i remember when he was at Villa, O'Neil gave him carte blanche to go off around the world attending seminars etc, in order to make Villa's fitness regime the best. I am sure he left us ewarly in Strachan's tenure. He is now, bizarrely, fitness coach for the huns. All that and you don't even know his name?
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Fast n Bulbous
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29 Aug 2014, 02:00 PM
Post #2044
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- idyllwild
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:42 PM
"We're all in this together." #Because.
Christ, it is just thoroughly depressing. We are at an impasse right now.
Lawwell will be going nowhere, so our only hope is for Ronny Deila to prove he actually knows what he's doing. He's a massive gamble and we desperately need for luck to be a lady, a situation we should never be in right now given our position of relative strength just a season and a half ago.
The board could and should have backed Lennon at that stage and brought in quality when we needed it. (It would also have been more cost effective Peter.)
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SwavBhoy
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29 Aug 2014, 02:00 PM
Post #2045
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- Ron Swanson
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:56 PM
- Luxo
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:51 PM
- Neil Jung
- 29 Aug 2014, 12:38 PM
Or the many fitness experts who have oversaw a deteriotian in the fitness of the first team squad since Strachan's time in charge.
This is an interesting point - and I just want to make a wee observation for anyone who isn't aware. Do you remember the big baldy guy who was the fitness coach under O'Neil? He was that the club for many years, and followed O'Neil to Villa and Sunderland - Scottish guy, he was very highly rated. he came from (i think) a wrestling background? I don't remember his name, but i remember when he was at Villa, O'Neil gave him carte blanche to go off around the world attending seminars etc, in order to make Villa's fitness regime the best. I am sure he left us ewarly in Strachan's tenure. He is now, bizarrely, fitness coach for the huns.
All that and you don't even know his name? Jim Henry. I think he was at Hibs as well.
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harryhoodshatrick
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29 Aug 2014, 02:02 PM
Post #2046
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Everyone's Fantasy Football first pick
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What I found so disappointing in the interview is that there was no acceptance that maybe we got it wrong not bringing in a couple of players,especially a striker ,before the champions league qualifiers.After the legia game we sold Forster for £10m and yet still didn't bring in a striker before the Maribor game which was worth £15m which is gross mismanagement.Its obvious lessons are still not being learnt.
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TravellingDoctorsShop
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29 Aug 2014, 02:03 PM
Post #2047
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- Ron Swanson
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:56 PM
- Luxo
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:51 PM
- Neil Jung
- 29 Aug 2014, 12:38 PM
Or the many fitness experts who have oversaw a deteriotian in the fitness of the first team squad since Strachan's time in charge.
This is an interesting point - and I just want to make a wee observation for anyone who isn't aware. Do you remember the big baldy guy who was the fitness coach under O'Neil? He was that the club for many years, and followed O'Neil to Villa and Sunderland - Scottish guy, he was very highly rated. he came from (i think) a wrestling background? I don't remember his name, but i remember when he was at Villa, O'Neil gave him carte blanche to go off around the world attending seminars etc, in order to make Villa's fitness regime the best. I am sure he left us ewarly in Strachan's tenure. He is now, bizarrely, fitness coach for the huns.
All that and you don't even know his name? Is it not Adam Owen? English chap
Was at Celtic, then Rangers and left. My mate bought his house and I am currently living in it, until I buy a new one.
edit - he is Welsh
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McStay
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29 Aug 2014, 02:07 PM
Post #2048
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I laughed when he was talking about Deila and said "we've still got the transfer window in terms of bringing in players"
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Ess
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29 Aug 2014, 02:10 PM
Post #2049
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Really poor response from PL and extremely patronising to think the support would accept such a one sided summary.
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Luxo
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29 Aug 2014, 02:12 PM
Post #2050
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- Ron Swanson
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:56 PM
- Luxo
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:51 PM
- Neil Jung
- 29 Aug 2014, 12:38 PM
Or the many fitness experts who have oversaw a deteriotian in the fitness of the first team squad since Strachan's time in charge.
This is an interesting point - and I just want to make a wee observation for anyone who isn't aware. Do you remember the big baldy guy who was the fitness coach under O'Neil? He was that the club for many years, and followed O'Neil to Villa and Sunderland - Scottish guy, he was very highly rated. he came from (i think) a wrestling background? I don't remember his name, but i remember when he was at Villa, O'Neil gave him carte blanche to go off around the world attending seminars etc, in order to make Villa's fitness regime the best. I am sure he left us ewarly in Strachan's tenure. He is now, bizarrely, fitness coach for the huns.
All that and you don't even know his name? Can't remember his name, and am loathe to go on the huns web site. Too many more important things to do.
Instead of typing that - you could have looked it up.
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Frank Ricard
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29 Aug 2014, 02:12 PM
Post #2051
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The money is there - Deila just hasn't spent it yet. The managers decision.
Lenny was backed. It's Lenny's fault that pukki, Griffith's and stokes aren't as good as hooper.
eff off Lawwell.
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Luxo
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29 Aug 2014, 02:13 PM
Post #2052
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- SwavBhoy
- 29 Aug 2014, 02:00 PM
- Ron Swanson
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:56 PM
- Luxo
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:51 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
All that and you don't even know his name?
Jim Henry. I think he was at Hibs as well. That's the guy.
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Goal
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29 Aug 2014, 02:13 PM
Post #2053
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- SwavBhoy
- 29 Aug 2014, 02:00 PM
- Ron Swanson
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:56 PM
- Luxo
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:51 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
All that and you don't even know his name?
Jim Henry. I think he was at Hibs as well. Was it not Roddy MacDonald?
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ChillerBee
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29 Aug 2014, 02:13 PM
Post #2054
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The usual bluster. Citing Gordon and Van Dijk as examples of replacing departed players is disingenuous given Van Dijk was brought in initially to partner Wilson and Gordon's well publicised issues. Those being the best he can do says it all about our fabled transfer strategy.
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bhoywunda
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29 Aug 2014, 02:24 PM
Post #2055
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Obvious bollocks from Lawwell aside, I was heartened to hear him publicly backing Deila. He was nowhere to be seen in the aftermath of Legia and I thought he was hanging Deila out to dry.
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anthony1967
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29 Aug 2014, 02:28 PM
Post #2056
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- Declan Brendan Timmy Bhoy
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:42 PM
- murphio
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:39 PM
He was completely disingenuous with some of his comments. He says Lenny spent 30m. And while that is obviously true the club has brought in something like 50m ftom the sales of McGeady, Fortune, Boruc, McManus, Maloney, Hoeiveld, Ki, Hooper, Ledley, Wanyama, Wilson and Forster. That is before we even account for a single penny from two Champions League campaigns including a last 16 place. To suggest that money has been reinvested in the team is utter, utter nonsense.
Add to that the money we got for the commonwealth games lease. £5 million or so ? We got £2.6m for the commonwealth games. A very tidy sum but not near the £5m I keep seeing reported.
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farney bhoy
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29 Aug 2014, 02:28 PM
Post #2057
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First name on the team-sheet
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- Corky Buczek
- 29 Aug 2014, 08:39 AM
- sevilliano
- 28 Aug 2014, 11:41 PM
Iydllwild posted yesterday that he couldn't bring himself to post the reasons why he'd ended up where he is now with Celtic and thinking it through I can see why but drink has been taken and I'm not angry but sad
However I think I'm a few years further down the road of cynicism but I do think the case for Celtic being far better than it is can be made without being sentimental
Born into a Celtic supporting family but whose first memories are feyenoord (not paying players?) and thistle whilst young at time of glory years it really is in subconscious rather than in memory
The real shock was healthy competition of early to mid 80s giving way to the Holmes Murray souness world where we we effed and the families who owned Celtic could not cope with banked backed entrepreneurs
Celtic in my formative years were a team filled with likes of burns provan Nicholas mccluskey - really nowhere on a par with 65-74 but a football team you could identify with and would make an effort to see because it was entertaining (albeit not when keepers let us down time and again)
We were not european giants but we were competent - losing to notts forest or sociedad was no disgrace and was close fought with good teams against us
So I don't dream of European glory and I've sat and watched the corrupt hun eff us through dark days at hampden ibrox etc etc
The arrival of fergus didn't fill me with joy cause I could see from working for him that his driver was his return
That it coincided with us stopping 10iar was luck for us and fergus because honestly he wouldn't change short term for long term but whilst that is commendable that strategy is medium long term and not fixated on short term in his reign Things have gone far askew since then
Fergus put 9m of his own money into Celtic for a return and having got it left
Dermot took up the slack but provides no direction or strategy since then
In basic terms dermot debted up the business under mon to compete with the hun and enjoyed high profile euro success then left it to his accountant since 2004 to drive the debt and business down
But in the meantime the euphoria of saving the club stopping 10 and achieving relative success in Europe and watching the demise of the hun over the last 8 years we've seen a club going nowhere
And really when the music stops you see that no one has been watching the football shop, that no one has kept alive the relationship between Celtic it's fans and football
We have moved from the useless rump of whytes and Kellys trying to play at business whilst extracting their inheritance on a bi weekly basis through our VC fergus to end up at a useless rump practised at property development, remuneration committees but with no commitment to football or Celtic
I think these guys who control, run our club fail because they either they don't give a flying one or can't be bothered looking at what makes a club work decade after decade - and it's not the balance sheet in their language it's the intangible
Not because they are taking the piss over money - dermot could make more elsewhere and pl could make close to what he earns at Celtic - but because they don't get it - they are focused on finance
My family in part supported Celtic because it was a catholic club but for a large part because it was a football club who played football - not kick and rush of the hun, not the bigotry of the hun
And that held true through the 80s as the legacy of lions and quality street filtered through
Since then though despite the slogans we've become just another club and as the corporate boys play their games we've moved further and further from being a football club based on the values of stein
So we fail as as corporate money making machine in a tiny country marginalised in uefa terms
But more so we fail because the core has been lost - of developing the identity of Celtic, of football, of youth, of community, of charity
We have football in the community officers at Celtic being tasked with being profit centres !! We have first team players being paid 1/10 of the CEO, it's effin mental how far away we've got from doing the basics right
60,000 people will come and support this football team because of a legacy and it's a good legacy
If only they understood that if they made a fist of understanding that they have to make the best of the environment we operate in by being a truly exceptional football club from youth upwards that would be enough
Instead in some kind of blairite new Celtic they try to persuade us that their way is the only way and we should be thankful as they spout pish and take their money year after year leaving others trying to work off fundamentally flawed club to shield them
Unlike idyll wild eff it I'll post it
Sev Fatboab posted immediately after the final whistle of Barca 6-1 debacle that the Board would go off and enjoy a glass of Rioja with the Barcelona directors and discuss on the flight home how they could do just enough to ensure we made the group stages this year. That is their mentality to a T. My disillusionment started in 2008/9 and particularly with PL. We had staged a great comeback to win the league and we had - as always - a chance to push on. We absolutely threw it away. I had a long conversation with someone involved in football and got chapter and verse of some of the dealings that happened that summer and that made me very concerned about what we were doing. We were looking for utterly unrealistic money for some of our own players - ensuring that players who were surplus to requirement weren't moved on - whilst putting bids in for players that I could only describe as a joke. Particularly as we had indicated something different in the verbal negotiations. It was a summer that saw us sign Loovens and Crosas - neither of whom would ever be described as a first choice and who were either way down their list or, in the case of the Dutchman, not even on it at the start of the summer. Come winter and we're crying out for goals and we all know what happened with Steven Fletcher. Oldco won the title and it was the first of three My utter cynicism with them is not a case of either spending money for the sake of it or spending money we don't have. It is a complete failure to spend from a position of strength thus ensuring that we have a better chance of getting the right player and continued success on the pitch with the riches it brings. Far too often we are buying players at the fag end of windows when the right ones have gone and we end with duds like Bangura,and Miku. Panic buys because the we haven't tried hard enough to get the players we really wanted. It is also economic stupidity. Look at the money we have lost on Balde, Pukki and Griffiths and think we would have actually saved money if we had given Hooper what he wanted. And please don't anybody say, "oh that would just have resulted in every other player demanding the same." That is nonsense - the same argument used by directors to justify their ludicrous salaries. PL and board really have continued in the same vein since 2008 and refuse to learn the lessons. I was told (and other can correct me if this info is wrong) that there was a difference of £2K a week with what Olivier Giroud wanted (when he was in the French 2nd division) and what we were prepared to give him. We then went out and signed Rasmussen. I accept totally that we can't get it right all the time and YOU WILL have bad buys at some point - it is unavoidable. But as Dianogah's separate thread proves, our policy on strikers has been an absolute clusterEff because we fail to accept that some times you have to push the boat out a bit more than you want to get the desired quality. The long terms results of that policy have financially cost us severely. Last summer I couldn't believe that we decided to get through the qualifiers without any serious attempts to replace some of the quality we had just sold. To say we scraped into the CL group stages doesn't do it justice. However I had resigned myself to conclude that PL would still try it again given half a chance. But even I've been taken aback at the shambles of this summer. We bring in a new manager and we conclude our first proper transfer deal (a player who isn't a loan or on a free due to not having a club) two days before the window shuts. Well as others have said, hitting them in the pocket is the only way to bring to their attention their utter folly. 2 great posts. Spot on.
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fatboab
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29 Aug 2014, 02:29 PM
Post #2058
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Just before the Dawn
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- anthony1967
- 29 Aug 2014, 02:28 PM
- Declan Brendan Timmy Bhoy
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:42 PM
- murphio
- 29 Aug 2014, 01:39 PM
He was completely disingenuous with some of his comments. He says Lenny spent 30m. And while that is obviously true the club has brought in something like 50m ftom the sales of McGeady, Fortune, Boruc, McManus, Maloney, Hoeiveld, Ki, Hooper, Ledley, Wanyama, Wilson and Forster. That is before we even account for a single penny from two Champions League campaigns including a last 16 place. To suggest that money has been reinvested in the team is utter, utter nonsense.
Add to that the money we got for the commonwealth games lease. £5 million or so ?
We got £2.6m for the commonwealth games. A very tidy sum but not near the £5m I keep seeing reported. incorrect
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Jungle_G
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29 Aug 2014, 02:46 PM
Post #2059
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The comments regarding replacing Hooper (or rather failing to do so) are as close as he comes to any sort of admission of responsibility or sense of accountability. Even then it's not very close. He reckons it's "a viable question" ie fair game for a bit of debate but still a tricky one. And its sandwhiched inbetween a pile of self-pitying shampooe about Shane Long and Ross McCormack and 'the environment' which amount to nothing by way of a defence at all. Other than that it seems that what we get for our £1m a year is guy capable of telling us how tough we've got it and, eh, that's it. It's tough so sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't, deal with it. Look everyone, this is hard, this bit is crap, that other bit is a challenge, everything's really difficult.
Great. Have another bonus. Can't pay a man enough for that level of perception and insight. Clearly for £250k p/a we'd have to employ four CEOs to reach the conclusion that a small league is hard going, and who could then fail to deliver anyway, but tell us why in less expert style. Probs best stick wi Pete then
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TheEvilGenius
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29 Aug 2014, 02:54 PM
Post #2060
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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So we sell our best players because of a team we've never played before? 
Ram it Pedro.
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