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Generic SPFL Thread; all the other stuff
Topic Started: 5 Apr 2014, 05:29 PM (152,784 Views)
tinsoldier
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Older than dirt
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Seantic91
12 May 2014, 03:11 PM
Craig Levein in, Gary Locke and Billy Brown out at Hearts????
Where you hear this mhate?
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TheEvilGenius
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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Bill Leckie will be pleased that Lennon has gone no doubt. ;)
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jake1958
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Just regarding the Danny Lennon sacking, I think this is a disgraceful decision. Interesting yo note during the relegation 'dogfight' and even prior to that, there were a number of teams in similar position to St Mirren but no media talk about their managers being under pressure or losing their jobs also compare the media campaign to get rid of Pat Fenlon at Hibs when they were in the top 6 compared to the almost total lack of criticism of Terry Butcher. I might be paranoid but could the intense media criticism be something to do with the fact that Danny and Pat both sound a bit taigy?
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Dubz
Getting on a bit
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Ally Les Verts
12 May 2014, 03:14 PM
Dubz
12 May 2014, 03:12 PM
Seantic91
12 May 2014, 03:11 PM
Craig Levein in, Gary Locke and Billy Brown out at Hearts????
Where you hearing this?
In here.
Cheers.
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Wee Ed KTF
Considering retirement
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Declan Brendan Timmy Bhoy
12 May 2014, 03:10 PM
Who the eff do St Mirren think they are ? :lol:

Lennon won them a cup and kept them in the Spl despite having his budget cut year on year.
I am puzzled as to what the expectation levels are by Gilmour and his St Mirren cronies?

Scottish Cup triumph? Top six in the SPFL? Winners of the SPFL? Champions League last 16?

Fuds

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randombloke
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Wee Ed KTF
12 May 2014, 03:57 PM
Declan Brendan Timmy Bhoy
12 May 2014, 03:10 PM
Who the eff do St Mirren think they are ? :lol:

Lennon won them a cup and kept them in the Spl despite having his budget cut year on year.
I am puzzled as to what the expectation levels are by Gilmour and his St Mirren cronies?

Scottish Cup triumph? Top six in the SPFL? Winners of the SPFL? Champions League last 16?

Fuds

I think the expectation (or hope) is simply that they don't want to be in a relegation battle every season and they believe that Lennon should be achieving more with the squad he has available.

Probably a similar situation with Locke at Hertz - it looks to us outsiders like he's done a decent job in difficult circumstances, but the guys who deal with him on a daily basis and see how he goes about the job might be saying "eff me, this guy is taking us nowhere, let's get rid of him before he becomes a problem"......arguably that's also what Hibs should have been saying about Fenlon a year before they did ditch him :lol:

Basically if you've been dodging relegation for 2 or 3 seasons then you need to change something before the inevitable happens. Most clubs that are down there don't have the cash to significantly improve the squad, so instead they ditch their manager in the hope that the next guy might have some fresh ideas on how to drag them back up the league.
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ChillerBee
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jake1958
12 May 2014, 03:27 PM
Just regarding the Danny Lennon sacking, I think this is a disgraceful decision. Interesting yo note during the relegation 'dogfight' and even prior to that, there were a number of teams in similar position to St Mirren but no media talk about their managers being under pressure or losing their jobs also compare the media campaign to get rid of Pat Fenlon at Hibs when they were in the top 6 compared to the almost total lack of criticism of Terry Butcher. I might be paranoid but could the intense media criticism be something to do with the fact that Danny and Pat both sound a bit taigy?
:cuckoo:
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mikebhoy
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randombloke
12 May 2014, 04:12 PM
Wee Ed KTF
12 May 2014, 03:57 PM
Declan Brendan Timmy Bhoy
12 May 2014, 03:10 PM
Who the eff do St Mirren think they are ? :lol:

Lennon won them a cup and kept them in the Spl despite having his budget cut year on year.
I am puzzled as to what the expectation levels are by Gilmour and his St Mirren cronies?

Scottish Cup triumph? Top six in the SPFL? Winners of the SPFL? Champions League last 16?

Fuds

I think the expectation (or hope) is simply that they don't want to be in a relegation battle every season and they believe that Lennon should be achieving more with the squad he has available.

Probably a similar situation with Locke at Hertz - it looks to us outsiders like he's done a decent job in difficult circumstances, but the guys who deal with him on a daily basis and see how he goes about the job might be saying "eff me, this guy is taking us nowhere, let's get rid of him before he becomes a problem"......arguably that's also what Hibs should have been saying about Fenlon a year before they did ditch him :lol:

Basically if you've been dodging relegation for 2 or 3 seasons then you need to change something before the inevitable happens. Most clubs that are down there don't have the cash to significantly improve the squad, so instead they ditch their manager in the hope that the next guy might have some fresh ideas on how to drag them back up the league.
That’s maybe fair enough, but did St Mirren not climb clear of relegation a fair while back? I remember they had a pretty dodgy run earlier in the season and I remember actually thinking that it was admirable that the St Mirren board were sticking by him. They certainly haven’t been as close to the wire at Kilmarnock or Partick Thistle, though maybe I’m giving them more credit than they deserve.

I suppose the likes of Ross County and (until Yogi rocked up) ICT are the sort of benchmark that clubs like St Mirren are aspiring to – comfortable mid-table/top 6 finishes. It could also be that he’s pissed off some or all of the board I suppose.
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randombloke
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mikebhoy
12 May 2014, 04:28 PM
randombloke
12 May 2014, 04:12 PM
Wee Ed KTF
12 May 2014, 03:57 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I think the expectation (or hope) is simply that they don't want to be in a relegation battle every season and they believe that Lennon should be achieving more with the squad he has available.

Probably a similar situation with Locke at Hertz - it looks to us outsiders like he's done a decent job in difficult circumstances, but the guys who deal with him on a daily basis and see how he goes about the job might be saying "eff me, this guy is taking us nowhere, let's get rid of him before he becomes a problem"......arguably that's also what Hibs should have been saying about Fenlon a year before they did ditch him :lol:

Basically if you've been dodging relegation for 2 or 3 seasons then you need to change something before the inevitable happens. Most clubs that are down there don't have the cash to significantly improve the squad, so instead they ditch their manager in the hope that the next guy might have some fresh ideas on how to drag them back up the league.
That’s maybe fair enough, but did St Mirren not climb clear of relegation a fair while back? I remember they had a pretty dodgy run earlier in the season and I remember actually thinking that it was admirable that the St Mirren board were sticking by him. They certainly haven’t been as close to the wire at Kilmarnock or Partick Thistle, though maybe I’m giving them more credit than they deserve.

I suppose the likes of Ross County and (until Yogi rocked up) ICT are the sort of benchmark that clubs like St Mirren are aspiring to – comfortable mid-table/top 6 finishes. It could also be that he’s pissed off some or all of the board I suppose.
I think there's also an element of any manager having a shelf life at a club and there comes a point where the powers that be just don't believe he has anything else to offer.

Looking at his league record over the four years he's been at St Mirren...

2010/11 - 11th place
2011/12 - 8th place
2012-13 - 11th place
2013-14 - 8th place (only 4 points clear of the play-off place and it took an unexpected run of 3 wins and 2 draws in the last 6 games to achieve that! )


So only 1 "safe" season in 4 and the constant threat of relegation the rest of the time and only abject perfomances from other teams and points deductions for administration keeping them up....good guy or not, you can see why his chairman wants somebody new in as manager before their luck runs out, especially now that the play off means they need two other clubs to have a dire season every year to keep them safe.
At a guess I'd also say Lennon has had more money to spend on players than the likes of ICT, Ross County and St Johnstone so there's an argument for saying it's only the League Cup win actually kept him in a job this long.
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jim62
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up on the roof!!

randombloke
12 May 2014, 05:47 PM
mikebhoy
12 May 2014, 04:28 PM
randombloke
12 May 2014, 04:12 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
That’s maybe fair enough, but did St Mirren not climb clear of relegation a fair while back? I remember they had a pretty dodgy run earlier in the season and I remember actually thinking that it was admirable that the St Mirren board were sticking by him. They certainly haven’t been as close to the wire at Kilmarnock or Partick Thistle, though maybe I’m giving them more credit than they deserve.

I suppose the likes of Ross County and (until Yogi rocked up) ICT are the sort of benchmark that clubs like St Mirren are aspiring to – comfortable mid-table/top 6 finishes. It could also be that he’s pissed off some or all of the board I suppose.
I think there's also an element of any manager having a shelf life at a club and there comes a point where the powers that be just don't believe he has anything else to offer.

Looking at his league record over the four years he's been at St Mirren...

2010/11 - 11th place
2011/12 - 8th place
2012-13 - 11th place
2013-14 - 8th place (only 4 points clear of the play-off place and it took an unexpected run of 3 wins and 2 draws in the last 6 games to achieve that! )


So only 1 "safe" season in 4 and the constant threat of relegation the rest of the time and only abject perfomances from other teams and points deductions for administration keeping them up....good guy or not, you can see why his chairman wants somebody new in as manager before their luck runs out, especially now that the play off means they need two other clubs to have a dire season every year to keep them safe.
At a guess I'd also say Lennon has had more money to spend on players than the likes of ICT, Ross County and St Johnstone so there's an argument for saying it's only the League Cup win actually kept him in a job this long.
My brother in law ( and the niece and nephew) are season ticket holders

They will be rejoicing at this news... Lennon had a squad more than capable of being top 6 ...arguably far better than ICT/St Johnstone /Motherwell.... he is utterly negative
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33-rpm
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I see Mulgrew, Brown and Griffiths are in the Scotland squad for an utterly pointless friendly against Nigeria at the end of the month. Shouldn't we be pulling these guys out considering the limited time they have off before they're back playing real football and in important Champions League qualifiers?
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arklys
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33-rpm
12 May 2014, 05:57 PM
I see Mulgrew, Brown and Griffiths are in the Scotland squad for an utterly pointless friendly against Nigeria at the end of the month. Shouldn't we be pulling these guys out considering the limited time they have off before they're back playing real football and in important Champions League qualifiers?
Will Efe be in the Nigeria squad as well? I suppose it's a more important game for them.
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J_C_X
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brianlara67
12 May 2014, 01:02 PM
Lawlerm
11 May 2014, 11:45 PM
J_C_X
11 May 2014, 09:15 PM
Aye. Viewing figures wouldn't jump with an exclusivity deal. Prior to the Aviva Premier League/BT deal Scottish football comfortably beats it for ratings on Sky and ESPN.
There's a huge difference between an exclusivity deal for rugby and for Scottish football though. Would more people subscribe to BT if they knew they'd get every SPL game? Probably a some would, yes. Nowhere near as many as for the Aviva rugby though.

The Aviva Premiership is basically the highest level of rugby you can watch in Europe (along with the Top 14) and rugby coverage is nowhere near as extensive as football. That means if you follow rugby to any extent you're likely to watch whatever Aviva Premiership game is on. If you're a Saracens fan you'll probably still watch the Harlequins game as you don't have an alternative and your still watching your favourite sport played at it's highest level.

In contrast most of us on here don't even watch the SPL unless Celtic are playing. If Motherwell and Aberdeen are on the TV most fans of the other 10 SPL teams are probably watching the EPL or Liga.

The benefits of getting exclusivity in each case are entirely different. The value of rugby rights is also boosted as it can be shown at 3pm on a Saturday when neither Sky or BT can show any football. We're not being short-changed by a TV deal. It goes out to commercial tender and it generates what the TV companies feel it's worth. Taking games off Sky wouldn't add 100,000+ viewers on BT - if it would they'd buy it.
"It goes out to commercial tender and it generates what the TV companies feel it's worth"

Aye but Scottish football is hampered by having the EPL not only on our doorstep but in the same country. Countries of similar size to Scotland like Norway have TV deals worth 4 times than the Scottish one because the National broadcasters in Norway serve Norway only and don't serve say the Bundesliga as well.
I think Neil Doncaster's SPFL willingness to take the first offer doesn't help either.

More people were watching the SPFL than Aviva Premier League Rugby, yet they managed to get a tv deal is worth 2.5x than that of ours. I don't think for one second that Sky thought the APL rights were worth £152m, but credit to the APL they used the threat of competition to their advantage.

Let's not forget that Sky thought the SPL rights were worth £120m when there was competition.
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Big Drew
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33-rpm
12 May 2014, 05:57 PM
I see Mulgrew, Brown and Griffiths are in the Scotland squad for an utterly pointless friendly against Nigeria at the end of the month. Shouldn't we be pulling these guys out considering the limited time they have off before they're back playing real football and in important Champions League qualifiers?
:ponder: do you think this how it works or are you just belly-aching?
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33-rpm
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Big Drew
12 May 2014, 06:41 PM
33-rpm
12 May 2014, 05:57 PM
I see Mulgrew, Brown and Griffiths are in the Scotland squad for an utterly pointless friendly against Nigeria at the end of the month. Shouldn't we be pulling these guys out considering the limited time they have off before they're back playing real football and in important Champions League qualifiers?
:ponder: do you think this how it works or are you just belly-aching?
I think it's how it should work, yes. Our Champions League qualifiers in early July are much more important than some friendly in London. Lennon's often talking about resting players towards the end of the season because they don't get that long of a summer break, so why should we send two of our most important players (and Leigh Griffiths) off to some completely meaningless friendly after our season has ended?
Edited by 33-rpm, 12 May 2014, 06:48 PM.
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rpceltic
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antrimkev
11 May 2014, 11:32 PM
I would loved killie to go down/had a play off to go down

not because Hibs are a big club but because the media are dying for Hibs to go down and join the gruesome twosome, and make that league out to be the be all and end all


I hope that Butcher is able to get Hibs up for the play offs - I couldn't stand a summer of the media spouting their pash

The Scottish media will have their morale raised by Hibs going down, no doubt about it. Even although Celtic fans all know there is no love lost with us and Hibs, the main stream media in their twisted and warped existence, see Hibs going down as a victory against the green.
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Big Drew
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33-rpm
12 May 2014, 06:47 PM
Big Drew
12 May 2014, 06:41 PM
33-rpm
12 May 2014, 05:57 PM
I see Mulgrew, Brown and Griffiths are in the Scotland squad for an utterly pointless friendly against Nigeria at the end of the month. Shouldn't we be pulling these guys out considering the limited time they have off before they're back playing real football and in important Champions League qualifiers?
:ponder: do you think this how it works or are you just belly-aching?
I think it's how it should work, yes. Our Champions League qualifiers in early July are much more important than some friendly in London. Lennon's often talking about resting players towards the end of the season because they don't get that long of a summer break, so why should we send two of our most important players (and Leigh Griffiths) off to some completely meaningless friendly after our season has ended?
But how does it work, not how you'd like it to work. A player makes the decision, not his club. if he wants to play he'll play and its feck all to do with you or Celtic. Lennon may decide to rest players for Celtic games but again he has no say in internationals. that's how it works. :thumbsup:
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remy mcswain
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Big Drew
12 May 2014, 06:56 PM
33-rpm
12 May 2014, 06:47 PM
Big Drew
12 May 2014, 06:41 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I think it's how it should work, yes. Our Champions League qualifiers in early July are much more important than some friendly in London. Lennon's often talking about resting players towards the end of the season because they don't get that long of a summer break, so why should we send two of our most important players (and Leigh Griffiths) off to some completely meaningless friendly after our season has ended?
But how does it work, not how you'd like it to work. A player makes the decision, not his club. if he wants to play he'll play and its feck all to do with you or Celtic. Lennon may decide to rest players for Celtic games but again he has no say in internationals. that's how it works. :thumbsup:
He could quite easily ask Strachan.
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26. Javier sanchez Broto
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Winning a cup is a great achievement but it can be used to mask horrific results, horrible football and a horrific manager.

Imagine we'd done our usual in the cup last year against Hibs in the final, Fenlon would have been considered a great appointment.

Don't see enough of St Mirren to judge, but I do like Danny Lennon.
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Big Drew
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remy mcswain
12 May 2014, 06:57 PM
Big Drew
12 May 2014, 06:56 PM
33-rpm
12 May 2014, 06:47 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
But how does it work, not how you'd like it to work. A player makes the decision, not his club. if he wants to play he'll play and its feck all to do with you or Celtic. Lennon may decide to rest players for Celtic games but again he has no say in internationals. that's how it works. :thumbsup:
He could quite easily ask Strachan.
33-rpm doesn't know strachan, does he? ;)

Broonie has said he loves playing for Scotland, with our season over what right would Lennon have in asking for him to be dropped? Euro qualifiers start pretty soon after the Worlld Cup and Strachan will be looking to get his team selections sorted.

i do get that a lot of folks on here don't care for international matches, but many of the players do.
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