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The All New Sevco Back in Yer Bin Thread; Taking out the trash
Topic Started: 29 Apr 2018, 04:24 PM (2,087,071 Views)
Burnley Celt
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Old fud, taking things easy......
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tonythetim
2 May 2018, 12:31 AM
Luca
1 May 2018, 08:21 PM
beaumontbhoy
1 May 2018, 08:08 PM
I wouldn’t e surprised if he takes it based on bt sports and it will be a disaster. Although he won’t get what he’s promised he will get way more than they can afford. They will go all in on an under 18 coach up against a vastly superior team who even if sevco spend way more than they can afford can spend more without it making a dent in cash flow
Isn’t Gerrard a bit thick as well? Always comes across as a bit dense.
5 GCSEs (A-C)

So better than average considering he was concentrating on football.
To be fair, Rodney Trotter had similar qualifications. ;)
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damosuzuki
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Season ticket bought and no way I'm selling ma shares when the future is brighter than ever.



Exciting times.




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johnbhoy1958
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Knackered with a Capital F!!!!
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tenerifetim
2 May 2018, 08:30 AM
Dubz
2 May 2018, 08:15 AM
M78
2 May 2018, 08:11 AM
Can someone c&p that please, can’t access it for some reason.
Fill yer Boots! :thumbsup:
I'm not convinced that article covers the last 2 unstarred motions business that occurred yesterday and a couple of weeks ago that TOP pursued - no real reporting on those ? :suspect:
Spoiler: click to toggle
1st thing(maybe wrongly) that I thought,also.Article says TOP received orders from Cos on 24th April.That's 8 days ago.Can't possibly include anything from yesterday,I think.
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sevilliano
Retired and now a BT Sports pundit
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King wants out and his money back - always has done - and he doesn't want to have to shell out on the takeover offer so banked on no takers. But i was told at least 4m worth want paid out

Rest of board want him out and good few have sunk money in - whatever no of bears have loans in last i heard of £17m

King wants gerrard in - rest didn't but may do now if part of plan to get king out

Gerrard needs money for squad
King needs paid out
Stadium needs fixed
[bears may need paid back]

If it was complete new money you're looking at at least 100m having to come in - and what possible return are you going to get on that - indeed will you ever get your money out

Even if bears weren't getting out looks nonsense

Unless there was way to get money back but that would only seem possible if there was change of environment which would suit us even more

Gerrard just looks like dave's squirrel to try to get share price up a bit and stop people looking for cash from him

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AG67
Getting on a bit
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Sounds like he is coming based on what is being said just now, but why is it taking SG so long to make his mind up. This notion that he will be able to attract top players is laughable, they need to clear out all the dead wood first - good luck finding buyers for most of that lot - even then where is the money coming from to buy these "top" players that will be literally queuing up to sign on at Ibrox ? Is Dave King planning to ask Gerrard for a loan when he arrives :ponder:
On the subject of top players, not so long back the media were all creaming themselves about the likes of Sean Goss and Greg Docherty in the Huns midfield, oh dear :lol:
Edited by AG67, 2 May 2018, 09:26 AM.
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LeedsTim
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Italy, Spain, Argentina, basically anyone but England.
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corsica1968
2 May 2018, 08:20 AM
Stoke, WBA, Southampton, West Ham, Leicester, Swansea, Palace, and Watford have all in the past 12 months been after a new manager. Every single one of them could have rewarded him 4x what sevco could and given him a transfer budget in the tens of millions. And that’s just the EPL.

That Gerard hasn’t even been in the rumour-mill for any of them demonstrates a lot.

He is simply not rated as a potential manager.

People are suggesting Ipswich as a possible destination. Again, there do not appear to be any rumours. Why? If he was such hot property, somebody down here would be courting him now to make sure they didn’t misss out.

There is a reason Ferdinand, Shearer, Gerard, etc are in punditry and not in management. One is what I call Hoddle Syndrome. Another is what I call Hawking Syndrome. Another is ego.

I had my doubts yesterday as he’d not said anything. I now think he’ll take it purely out of ego. And he’ll be back south before Christmas.

I think he'll take it too but I think he will be there longer than six months. I'd give him two seasons. If and when we reach 9, he'll be gone and there will be a mad frantic rush to bring someone in to stop the 10. If the Cardigan has passed on they'll probably try to dig him up or consult Struth by seance.
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Hairytoes
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Gothamcelt
2 May 2018, 07:20 AM
Even Kris Boyd can see what rangers get up to every season, “You could start writing the headlines again at the same time next year. As soon as the season tickets go on sale there are headlines to be made".

b]Risky deal Rangers can’t take a gamble on Steven Gerrard… it’s not a club where an untried boss can serve an apprenticeship says Kris Boyd[/b]
The ex-Gers striker insists his old club need to stop chopping and changing bosses and players if they ever want to challenge Celtic again
Spoiler: click to toggle
Reading how often Boyd mentions "headlines & Media", shows just how much importance they put on - how they appear to others.
They want to be controlling the narrative & having their "go to guys" in the media. Jabba et al have probably done them more harm & are an open laughing stock among Celtic fans, with their daily Moonbeams laughed out of town & saved for future hilarity when it all goes tits up.

Compare to Celtic, who pretty much treat the Media with total disdain, keep our powder dry & stick to operating a successful model on & off the pitch.
This is shared among our fans, who also don't give a shampoo about the press or what they say - we know we're on top & can trust in our Club.

Boyd is right in that Sevco consistently lurch from one calamity to the next, that is the reason they feel the need to be controlling the narrative & pushing Moonbeams in the press to polish turds & sell season books.
Meanwhile, we'll build a hotel or install a £5m Desso pitch, or release accounts on time (brimming with money) & concentrate on doing it all again - the press will grudgingly cover it all anyway.

They're a strange bunch, it's all about how you appear with them, bravado etc... Is that why guys like Jimmy Nichol, Jimmy Bell, Bomber Brown etc hang around so much? Our versions of that are Bertie Auld, John Clarke, Davie Hay - completely different characters.
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ronny_is_not_da_man
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"There has always been class inside the building" :ffs: Aye it was classy banning catholics and then spending money you don't have to massage your ego :nono:
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FenianJack
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Getting on a bit
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LeedsTim
2 May 2018, 09:27 AM
corsica1968
2 May 2018, 08:20 AM
Stoke, WBA, Southampton, West Ham, Leicester, Swansea, Palace, and Watford have all in the past 12 months been after a new manager. Every single one of them could have rewarded him 4x what sevco could and given him a transfer budget in the tens of millions. And that’s just the EPL.

That Gerard hasn’t even been in the rumour-mill for any of them demonstrates a lot.

He is simply not rated as a potential manager.

People are suggesting Ipswich as a possible destination. Again, there do not appear to be any rumours. Why? If he was such hot property, somebody down here would be courting him now to make sure they didn’t misss out.

There is a reason Ferdinand, Shearer, Gerard, etc are in punditry and not in management. One is what I call Hoddle Syndrome. Another is what I call Hawking Syndrome. Another is ego.

I had my doubts yesterday as he’d not said anything. I now think he’ll take it purely out of ego. And he’ll be back south before Christmas.

I think he'll take it too but I think he will be there longer than six months. I'd give him two seasons. If and when we reach 9, he'll be gone and there will be a mad frantic rush to bring someone in to stop the 10. If the Cardigan has passed on they'll probably try to dig him up or consult Struth by seance.
:lol:
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Muzz
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BRFA
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"We are Rangers, Sevco Rangers. No one likes us, we really care :cry: "
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AG67
Getting on a bit
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FenianJack
2 May 2018, 09:34 AM
LeedsTim
2 May 2018, 09:27 AM
corsica1968
2 May 2018, 08:20 AM
Stoke, WBA, Southampton, West Ham, Leicester, Swansea, Palace, and Watford have all in the past 12 months been after a new manager. Every single one of them could have rewarded him 4x what sevco could and given him a transfer budget in the tens of millions. And that’s just the EPL.

That Gerard hasn’t even been in the rumour-mill for any of them demonstrates a lot.

He is simply not rated as a potential manager.

People are suggesting Ipswich as a possible destination. Again, there do not appear to be any rumours. Why? If he was such hot property, somebody down here would be courting him now to make sure they didn’t misss out.

There is a reason Ferdinand, Shearer, Gerard, etc are in punditry and not in management. One is what I call Hoddle Syndrome. Another is what I call Hawking Syndrome. Another is ego.

I had my doubts yesterday as he’d not said anything. I now think he’ll take it purely out of ego. And he’ll be back south before Christmas.

I think he'll take it too but I think he will be there longer than six months. I'd give him two seasons. If and when we reach 9, he'll be gone and there will be a mad frantic rush to bring someone in to stop the 10. If the Cardigan has passed on they'll probably try to dig him up or consult Struth by seance.
:lol:
No, they will put Jimmy Nicholl in the job in a defiant, last stand act of "No Surrender" :rocker:
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greenmachine
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Dave King is doing just fine , hope he stays for years to come.
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ronny_is_not_da_man
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Off treasure hunting in Holland
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LeedsTim
2 May 2018, 09:27 AM
corsica1968
2 May 2018, 08:20 AM
Stoke, WBA, Southampton, West Ham, Leicester, Swansea, Palace, and Watford have all in the past 12 months been after a new manager. Every single one of them could have rewarded him 4x what sevco could and given him a transfer budget in the tens of millions. And that’s just the EPL.

That Gerard hasn’t even been in the rumour-mill for any of them demonstrates a lot.

He is simply not rated as a potential manager.

People are suggesting Ipswich as a possible destination. Again, there do not appear to be any rumours. Why? If he was such hot property, somebody down here would be courting him now to make sure they didn’t misss out.

There is a reason Ferdinand, Shearer, Gerard, etc are in punditry and not in management. One is what I call Hoddle Syndrome. Another is what I call Hawking Syndrome. Another is ego.

I had my doubts yesterday as he’d not said anything. I now think he’ll take it purely out of ego. And he’ll be back south before Christmas.

I think he'll take it too but I think he will be there longer than six months. I'd give him two seasons. If and when we reach 9, he'll be gone and there will be a mad frantic rush to bring someone in to stop the 10. If the Cardigan has passed on they'll probably try to dig him up or consult Struth by seance.
:lol: :lol:
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Bertie Peacock
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The Little Ant
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Harris Tottle
2 May 2018, 08:16 AM
With the Sevvies hovering somewhere between stage 4 (depression) and 5 (acceptance) on the Kubler Ross model, I wonder how long it will be before some more radical thinking is deployed to stop Declan lording it over ra peepul.

Something like gate sharing to make the league “more competitive”. I can almost read that Keef Jackson column already.
I think 1 point for a win 2 points for a score draw and 3 points for a scoreless draw would work :)
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Martoto
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How can they keep banging on about investors coming in? They seem to have no conception that the current incumbent "investors" in the club have invested eff all. The club is in debt to them. They owe the RRM and the scorpion King for dragging them to the summit of achieving eff all and with no practical means of doing better with what they already have.

The only "investment" that could possibly have any real impact is if they go into admin, and a buyer makes an acceptable CVA offer with spare change to put them on a reasonably competitive footing afterwards and take it from there. But that's not what they want. And it's not King or the RRM want. So they are effed.
Edited by Martoto, 2 May 2018, 09:51 AM.
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weebaldy
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We Won the Big One-They Never Will!
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Muzz
2 May 2018, 09:36 AM
"We are Rangers, Sevco Rangers. No one likes us, we really care :cry: "
Yes, you have to laugh at that particular charming ditty of theirs. For a group of fans who sing about "not caring" week in and week out, they certainly aren't slow in coming out and condemning other clubs, the fans of other clubs, the SFA, the referees, the schools, the SNP, the world :lol:
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Luca
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Hun in work "We're starting to become a laughing stock"

"starting" :rubeyes:
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Ned Rise
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Hoops For Me All The Way
2 May 2018, 12:56 AM
As usual, a thoughtful and informative post by Barcabhoy. He's made it on TSFM. Unfortunately I can't get a link for the post itself, but it's currently the last one on the current blog. Maybe someone can help and post it for others, please.

:thumbsup: in anticipation.

Edit spelling. And add- hope this works

Quote:
 
The financial gap between Celtic and Rangers isn’t something that can be filled by investors .
The numbers are so vast only a benefactor , who is prepared to write off their gifts , could provide a level platform

Based on the audited accounts of both to June 2017 the scale of the challenge for Rangers is very clear.
In addition the financial year to June 2018 will show a very significantly increased gap, as Celtic grow revenues, whilst receiving a 2nd half year boost to profitability from the Van Djik sell on fee.

Rangers meanwhile made disastrous decisions on recruitment which has increased costs and asset purchase for no benefit whatsoever

Celtic in 2017 had a revenue which is 3.1 times higher than Rangers. That gives Celtic an extra £61M a year to spend.
Celtic bring in £16 Million a year more than Rangers in gate receipts and hospitality. With Rangers already at maximum season ticket sales , there is no prospect of Celtic not maintaining a significant advantage

Celtic bring in £31 Million a year more than Rangers in the Broadcast and commercial area. Much of this is Champions League payments, which Celtic will have exclusive opportunity to access again for 2018-19

Celtic have mature well defined multiple channels for merchandising. They also have the benefit that success brings to this category. Rangers by contrast have D list kit suppliers , fans groups competing for the blue pound and no mature channel operation

What is required to compete

A manager of similar ability to Brendan Rodgers

A squad with a starting XI who could get a game for Celtic

That means spending at least an extra £1 M a year on a manager , and even then you need to get lucky

It means signing 11 new players . With an average wage of £1 million a year each and a transfer budget of £25 Million

So you need to increase wages by at least £12 million a year and fund a £25 million transfer budget . Given the wages need to be covered for 3 years , someone needs to commit to a circa £60 Million cash injection and that’s before funding the existing shortfall

With no guarantee , or even a realistic possibility, of a return.


That’s why INVESTORS aren’t the solution. The return on investment potential is negligible. Far more likely that you lose it all. The risk factor will deter any serious investor. RIFC have had 5 years of losing money and failing to meet shareholders expectations . Rangers need a benefactor. The problem is they have needed one for well over a decade and no such individual has appeared.
2018-19 at best might bring in EL group revenue of possibly £7 million . Therefore if Rangers get in a top class manager and spend as outlined the best they could hope for would be a £17 million loss to the year ended June 2019. However fail to make the EL Group stage and the loss could be well over £20 million. The notion that you can fund the required spend by selling existing squad players is absurd.
If they don’t win the league at the new managers first attempt then they face the same losses for the following year. No responsible board could contemplate that risk without the cash to cover it being IN PLACE , not based on a promise or a PR stunt.

Even if , and it’s the remotest of possibilities , somebody out there is prepared to launch £60 M at Rangers, the reality is that wouldn’t get them as good a squad as Celtic or as good a manager. There is more than ample historic, current and publicly available data for anyone to come to the same financial conclusions i’ve reached here.

The problem for Rangers is that their fans, or many of them, think instant success is possible. They think it’s just a matter of “someone” providing the cash.
The bigger problem for Rangers is that even if the “cold day in hell “ event occurs and they get hold of a huge gift of cash, Celtic are so well resourced that they could easily put themselves well beyond Rangers once again
The reality is that a far better plan is to employ a smart young manager and sign as many of the best young players that your budget will allow, whilst breaking even. That way a team could grow together, profits on the sale of the best of the young players could be reinvested whilst positioning yourself for any slip Celtic may make.

Which almost certainly means that this won’t be the route Rangers take……at least not with this board
I like the sound of a lot of that, but "signing 11 new players . With an average wage of £1 million a year each and a transfer budget of £25 Million"?

I'm not too sure.

Others will know better than me if it's close to the mark, but there was a post on the Rogic thread saying he's on 15K per week, while our average is £14k per week. So I'm not sure why Sevco would have to be buying first team players on a higher average salary than us.

The reality for them is they don't need to sign the likes of Sinclair and Dembele on big pay packets, they just need to sign better players than the ones they have and pay them more, or the same, as what they currently get. It doesn't have to get near that type of wage and it doesn't mean they have to sign players for an average of over £2m each. Loan deals, bargains, out-of contracts, scouting (I know, I know...), basically doing the things that a football club in their position should, rather than hoping for some carrot tae pit his hauns in his fukkin poakits all the time.

Players will want to join them. Whether they're good enough is another matter. Charlie Adam is one who was letting it be known that he'd go there. Murphy, Dorrans etc 'answered the call' in their time of need. No luck that their appearance coincided with the team getting even worse. :lol:

There will be dyed in the wool huns who will take a financial hit to play, and there are others who will come for the wage packet. If they got a reasonably savvy manager, they could improve the team, even with the current players and a few additions, so that they're less of a basket case than they are now.

I'm surprised they haven't gone for Tommy Wright. If they huns are going to get beat, they'll want to go down kicking and fighting and he'd at least instill that into them. He probably has a decent idea of what it takes to make an average squad into a solid if unspectacular side. I don't think they'd win anything anytime soon, but it would stop them sinking further into the seemingly bottomless pit that they keep buying extra shovels for.
Edited by Ned Rise, 2 May 2018, 10:07 AM.
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ian1888
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garioch
2 May 2018, 02:10 AM
Hoops For Me All The Way
2 May 2018, 12:56 AM
As usual, a thoughtful and informative post by Barcabhoy. He's made it on TSFM. Unfortunately I can't get a link for the post itself, but it's currently the last one on the current blog. Maybe someone can help and post it for others, please.

:thumbsup: in anticipation.

Edit spelling. And add- hope this works

Quote:
 
The financial gap between Celtic and Rangers isn’t something that can be filled by investors .
The numbers are so vast only a benefactor , who is prepared to write off their gifts , could provide a level platform

Based on the audited accounts of both to June 2017 the scale of the challenge for Rangers is very clear.
In addition the financial year to June 2018 will show a very significantly increased gap, as Celtic grow revenues, whilst receiving a 2nd half year boost to profitability from the Van Djik sell on fee.

Rangers meanwhile made disastrous decisions on recruitment which has increased costs and asset purchase for no benefit whatsoever

Celtic in 2017 had a revenue which is 3.1 times higher than Rangers. That gives Celtic an extra £61M a year to spend.
Celtic bring in £16 Million a year more than Rangers in gate receipts and hospitality. With Rangers already at maximum season ticket sales , there is no prospect of Celtic not maintaining a significant advantage

Celtic bring in £31 Million a year more than Rangers in the Broadcast and commercial area. Much of this is Champions League payments, which Celtic will have exclusive opportunity to access again for 2018-19

Celtic have mature well defined multiple channels for merchandising. They also have the benefit that success brings to this category. Rangers by contrast have D list kit suppliers , fans groups competing for the blue pound and no mature channel operation

What is required to compete

A manager of similar ability to Brendan Rodgers

A squad with a starting XI who could get a game for Celtic

That means spending at least an extra £1 M a year on a manager , and even then you need to get lucky

It means signing 11 new players . With an average wage of £1 million a year each and a transfer budget of £25 Million

So you need to increase wages by at least £12 million a year and fund a £25 million transfer budget . Given the wages need to be covered for 3 years , someone needs to commit to a circa £60 Million cash injection and that’s before funding the existing shortfall

With no guarantee , or even a realistic possibility, of a return.


That’s why INVESTORS aren’t the solution. The return on investment potential is negligible. Far more likely that you lose it all. The risk factor will deter any serious investor. RIFC have had 5 years of losing money and failing to meet shareholders expectations . Rangers need a benefactor. The problem is they have needed one for well over a decade and no such individual has appeared.
2018-19 at best might bring in EL group revenue of possibly £7 million . Therefore if Rangers get in a top class manager and spend as outlined the best they could hope for would be a £17 million loss to the year ended June 2019. However fail to make the EL Group stage and the loss could be well over £20 million. The notion that you can fund the required spend by selling existing squad players is absurd.
If they don’t win the league at the new managers first attempt then they face the same losses for the following year. No responsible board could contemplate that risk without the cash to cover it being IN PLACE , not based on a promise or a PR stunt.

Even if , and it’s the remotest of possibilities , somebody out there is prepared to launch £60 M at Rangers, the reality is that wouldn’t get them as good a squad as Celtic or as good a manager. There is more than ample historic, current and publicly available data for anyone to come to the same financial conclusions i’ve reached here.

The problem for Rangers is that their fans, or many of them, think instant success is possible. They think it’s just a matter of “someone” providing the cash.
The bigger problem for Rangers is that even if the “cold day in hell “ event occurs and they get hold of a huge gift of cash, Celtic are so well resourced that they could easily put themselves well beyond Rangers once again
The reality is that a far better plan is to employ a smart young manager and sign as many of the best young players that your budget will allow, whilst breaking even. That way a team could grow together, profits on the sale of the best of the young players could be reinvested whilst positioning yourself for any slip Celtic may make.

Which almost certainly means that this won’t be the route Rangers take……at least not with this board
And that would be why ( much as it may have annoyed us at times) we should be grateful for Fergus onwards who kept the spending under control and built a sustainable organization.
great read that ! :thumbsup:
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Don Vito
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Hairytoes
2 May 2018, 09:27 AM
Gothamcelt
2 May 2018, 07:20 AM
Even Kris Boyd can see what rangers get up to every season, “You could start writing the headlines again at the same time next year. As soon as the season tickets go on sale there are headlines to be made".

b]Risky deal Rangers can’t take a gamble on Steven Gerrard… it’s not a club where an untried boss can serve an apprenticeship says Kris Boyd[/b]
The ex-Gers striker insists his old club need to stop chopping and changing bosses and players if they ever want to challenge Celtic again
Spoiler: click to toggle
Reading how often Boyd mentions "headlines & Media", shows just how much importance they put on - how they appear to others.
They want to be controlling the narrative & having their "go to guys" in the media. Jabba et al have probably done them more harm & are an open laughing stock among Celtic fans, with their daily Moonbeams laughed out of town & saved for future hilarity when it all goes tits up.

Compare to Celtic, who pretty much treat the Media with total disdain, keep our powder dry & stick to operating a successful model on & off the pitch.
This is shared among our fans, who also don't give a shampoo about the press or what they say - we know we're on top & can trust in our Club.

Boyd is right in that Sevco consistently lurch from one calamity to the next, that is the reason they feel the need to be controlling the narrative & pushing Moonbeams in the press to polish turds & sell season books.
Meanwhile, we'll build a hotel or install a £5m Desso pitch, or release accounts on time (brimming with money) & concentrate on doing it all again - the press will grudgingly cover it all anyway.

They're a strange bunch, it's all about how you appear with them, bravado etc... Is that why guys like Jimmy Nichol, Jimmy Bell, Bomber Brown etc hang around so much? Our versions of that are Bertie Auld, John Clarke, Davie Hay - completely different characters.
The paragraph about the ex players is spot on. :thumbsup:

On a different note, I hope SG gets the job. I think it will focus our whole club even more and provide good pr for Scottish football. It will be fun to see him getting beaten by us and eventually return to punditry down in engurland.
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