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The Media
Topic Started: 1 Nov 2017, 11:12 PM (581,134 Views)
qualitystreetkid
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Ned Rise
16 Feb 2018, 05:12 PM
qualitystreetkid
16 Feb 2018, 05:05 PM
Lubo25
16 Feb 2018, 03:16 PM
There are few enough outlets that offer a variety of different news and opinions in Scotland
If these outlets really did offer what you suggest then arguably there might be some ray of hope, and perhaps even a shred of sympathy.

But when you have a largely unregulated industry full of piss poor managers employing a short sighted strategy with a culturally backward approach to the value of real news and worthwhile opinion then they fully deserve their fate.
Is that what's happening in the global printed media then, all piss poor managers with a culturally backward approach to the value of real news and worthwhile opinion?

Even Theresa May had recognised that local and national newspapers are essential to a democracy.

Probably quite a few folk on this board that have seen these papers campaign for their jobs and their health.

I doubt anyone would expect much in the way of solidarity etc, but folk gloating is a bit of a stretch tbh.
I didn’t mention global media and neither am I gloating. Scotland was the context - and why I highlighted part of the comment from Lubo25.

I don’t disagree with ‘even’ Theresa May either in this point, but I do think that local and national papers need to up their game. The lowest common denominator isn’t the answer and I cannot see where there is effort to elevate quality.

It seems to me this part of the media can’t even survive in the arena they created. For that I have no sympathy whatsoever.
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Ned Rise
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qualitystreetkid
16 Feb 2018, 05:33 PM
Ned Rise
16 Feb 2018, 05:12 PM
qualitystreetkid
16 Feb 2018, 05:05 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Is that what's happening in the global printed media then, all piss poor managers with a culturally backward approach to the value of real news and worthwhile opinion?

Even Theresa May had recognised that local and national newspapers are essential to a democracy.

Probably quite a few folk on this board that have seen these papers campaign for their jobs and their health.

I doubt anyone would expect much in the way of solidarity etc, but folk gloating is a bit of a stretch tbh.
I didn’t mention global media and neither am I gloating. Scotland was the context - and why I highlighted part of the comment from Lubo25.

I don’t disagree with ‘even’ Theresa May either in this point, but I do think that local and national papers need to up their game. The lowest common denominator isn’t the answer and I cannot see where there is effort to elevate quality.

It seems to me this part of the media can’t even survive in the arena they created. For that I have no sympathy whatsoever.
Okay, fully deserve their fate isn't gloating*.

And I guess the miners and steelworkers and all of Scotland's industrial base fully deserved their fate too.

At the end of the day, everyone just fully deserves their fate.

*That apart, there has been gloating on the last couple of pages.
Edited by Ned Rise, 16 Feb 2018, 05:37 PM.
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Lubo25
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qualitystreetkid
16 Feb 2018, 05:05 PM
Lubo25
16 Feb 2018, 03:16 PM
There are few enough outlets that offer a variety of different news and opinions in Scotland
If these outlets really did offer what you suggest then arguably there might be some ray of hope, and perhaps even a shred of sympathy.

But when you have a largely unregulated industry full of piss poor managers employing a short sighted strategy with a culturally backward approach to the value of real news and worthwhile opinion then they fully deserve their fate.
I don't believe any of that to be true

without newspapers - local or national - no one holds politicians to account; no one reports on important court cases; no one turns up at local council meetings to scrutinise the decisions made that affect everyone's lives

print media can survive in the digital age, it just needs to work out what any audience wants from it

like I say, I realise I'm in a minority esp when it comes to the Scottish media. Most people working in it are professional folks just trying to do a difficult job. And there are fewer and fewer of those jobs around
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Stockholm87
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There are two sides to this , on the one hand quality investigative journalism is important on the other hand this is the DR we're talking about.
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qualitystreetkid
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Ned Rise
16 Feb 2018, 05:35 PM
qualitystreetkid
16 Feb 2018, 05:33 PM
Ned Rise
16 Feb 2018, 05:12 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I didn’t mention global media and neither am I gloating. Scotland was the context - and why I highlighted part of the comment from Lubo25.

I don’t disagree with ‘even’ Theresa May either in this point, but I do think that local and national papers need to up their game. The lowest common denominator isn’t the answer and I cannot see where there is effort to elevate quality.

It seems to me this part of the media can’t even survive in the arena they created. For that I have no sympathy whatsoever.
Okay, fully deserve their fate isn't gloating*.

And I guess the miners and steelworkers and all of Scotland's industrial base fully deserved their fate too.

At the end of the day, everyone just fully deserves their fate.

*That apart, there has been gloating on the last couple of pages.
I don’t mind how you interpret it Ned - your perspective is different and at least as valuable.

I’m not referring to individuals (that clearly would be so wide ranging as to be futile), but to businesses. My father, his brothers and his his father were all steel workers. They didn’t deserve their fate when they lost their jobs and my anger then was directed at how badly the industry was operated.

But sure, I’ll retract the fully deserving aspect - I’m not insensitive to the individual view.
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timbojon
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Sou'sider Bhoy
16 Feb 2018, 10:56 AM
There must have been a competition in the Radio Scotland newsroom this morning to figure out the absolute minimum they could say on the 8.25 report about Celtic's victory last night. Left plenty more time for a complete arse like Alex Rae to tell us all about the Cat in the Hat.
aye but did you believe him when he ruled himself out the assistant,s job ..... nah me neither ;)
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murphio
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When you have mouths to feed and a mortgage to pay it's worrying. Personally speaking I don't know much else. I'm 43 which leaves you in a bit of a fix - they could bring the axe down on our place tomorrow. As usual it will be the ordinary working guy who suffers; won't cost the big wigs and fat cats their healthy bonus.
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qualitystreetkid
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Lubo25
16 Feb 2018, 05:40 PM
qualitystreetkid
16 Feb 2018, 05:05 PM
Lubo25
16 Feb 2018, 03:16 PM
There are few enough outlets that offer a variety of different news and opinions in Scotland
If these outlets really did offer what you suggest then arguably there might be some ray of hope, and perhaps even a shred of sympathy.

But when you have a largely unregulated industry full of piss poor managers employing a short sighted strategy with a culturally backward approach to the value of real news and worthwhile opinion then they fully deserve their fate.
I don't believe any of that to be true

without newspapers - local or national - no one holds politicians to account; no one reports on important court cases; no one turns up at local council meetings to scrutinise the decisions made that affect everyone's lives

print media can survive in the digital age, it just needs to work out what any audience wants from it

like I say, I realise I'm in a minority esp when it comes to the Scottish media. Most people working in it are professional folks just trying to do a difficult job. And there are fewer and fewer of those jobs around
I agree, there is a role for news media, especially in the types of examples you give. I don’t think there is sufficient quality and focus there.

I don’t think printed media as a format will survive much longer (although maybe I’ve read too much of the AI thread), but with regard to figuring out what an audience wants, hasn’t it been more about trying to adapt the customer to the industry needs? Like I mentioned to Ned Rise this all has the feel of being consumed by the monster you created.
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Ned Rise
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qualitystreetkid
16 Feb 2018, 06:03 PM
Lubo25
16 Feb 2018, 05:40 PM
qualitystreetkid
16 Feb 2018, 05:05 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I don't believe any of that to be true

without newspapers - local or national - no one holds politicians to account; no one reports on important court cases; no one turns up at local council meetings to scrutinise the decisions made that affect everyone's lives

print media can survive in the digital age, it just needs to work out what any audience wants from it

like I say, I realise I'm in a minority esp when it comes to the Scottish media. Most people working in it are professional folks just trying to do a difficult job. And there are fewer and fewer of those jobs around
I agree, there is a role for news media, especially in the types of examples you give. I don’t think there is sufficient quality and focus there.

I don’t think printed media as a format will survive much longer (although maybe I’ve read too much of the AI thread), but with regard to figuring out what an audience wants, hasn’t it been more about trying to adapt the customer to the industry needs? Like I mentioned to Ned Rise this all has the feel of being consumed by the monster you created.
Aye, but the idea that people are going to give up their time to carry out investigative journalism for free, or for a few shares on a blog, is fanciful.

There are some great blogs and podcasts etc out there, but from what I've seen it's not really a decent alternative.

The point about the job losses in the steel industry etc was less to do with individuals, it was to do with papers campaigning so save those jobs. I don't think the media have created the monster, it's trying to survive it. There's not enough money in digital to pay for the kind of things you're highlighting you want to see.

At the end of the day, people just don't buy printed news (and I fully understand why that is, because I rarely do it myself). I'm just saying the alternative isn't as rosy as people think, and it certainly isn't as regulated.
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qualitystreetkid
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Ned Rise
16 Feb 2018, 06:10 PM
qualitystreetkid
16 Feb 2018, 06:03 PM
Lubo25
16 Feb 2018, 05:40 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I agree, there is a role for news media, especially in the types of examples you give. I don’t think there is sufficient quality and focus there.

I don’t think printed media as a format will survive much longer (although maybe I’ve read too much of the AI thread), but with regard to figuring out what an audience wants, hasn’t it been more about trying to adapt the customer to the industry needs? Like I mentioned to Ned Rise this all has the feel of being consumed by the monster you created.
Aye, but the idea that people are going to give up their time to carry out investigative journalism for free, or for a few shares on a blog, is fanciful.

There are some great blogs and podcasts etc out there, but from what I've seen it's not really a decent alternative.

The point about the job losses in the steel industry etc was less to do with individuals, it was to do with papers campaigning so save those jobs. I don't think the media have created the monster, it's trying to survive it. There's not enough money in digital to pay for the kind of things you're highlighting you want to see.

At the end of the day, people just don't buy printed news (and I fully understand why that is, because I rarely do it myself). I'm just saying the alternative isn't as rosy as people think, and it certainly isn't as regulated.
:thumbsup:
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JCBhoy
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Chris Union Jack in tonights Evening Times:

"He (Tavernier) in an attacking sense, is the most accomplished full back in the country"

:suspect:
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justinjest
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The record has been anti Celtic for as long as I can remember - just off the top of my head, the hearse sent to CP when it looked like we might go under, the Thugs, thieves headline, the time they put a 4 page spread on the 10th? anniversary of rangers battle with leeds on the day we had a big CL night and the new team were still languishing in the championship (I wonder what sector of the population they were aiming for?), negativity in our transfers / positivity in theirs - much as I don't want to see anyone losing their jobs, I won't miss the record or its biased reporting - or the sunday post and its sectarian employment policy (no papes need apply).
Edited by justinjest, 16 Feb 2018, 07:58 PM.
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Lobey Dosser
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Lubo25
16 Feb 2018, 03:16 PM
tenerifetim
16 Feb 2018, 03:11 PM
@Murrayf00te sports editor of Rectum has jacked it in -financial pressure now coming on ?
"Goodbye and thanks for all the Pish !" - DouglasAdams.CSC

:Bye:

he's the actual editor of the paper, not the sports editor

I'm biased because I worked with him but Murray Foote is actually a really good guy doing a job that's become impossible. Virtually no experienced staff left, more job cuts to come.

the way things are going, the Record will be lucky to see the end of the year. It already contains too much content that comes from the Mirror because they refuse to invest anything in the Scottish titles. That's only going to get worse.

I'll be in a minority with this view, but it would be very bad news if the Record shut. There are few enough outlets that offer a variety of different news and opinions in Scotland
Aye a variety of pish.

If the Rectum goes, I'll be having a few pints, it's a scumbag of a rag.
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weebaldy
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Gothamcelt
16 Feb 2018, 10:35 AM
Bill Leckie has a good piece on the game last night, until he has a wee dig at the GB.
Possibly couldn't help himself but then again I'm sure he will report what he hears when rangers play at the weekend.

LOUD AND PROUD Celtic’s win against Zenit St Petersburg was one of the finest European nights at Parkhead says Bill Leckie
The margins between them going over to Russia 1-0 up or 4-0 up were as thin as the sole on a modern-day boot
Spoiler: click to toggle
Was at the game and I for one never heard the up the Ra at the start of the game. I maybe wrong but did anyone else hear it prior to kick off or is it just that carrots selective hearing? :thumbsup:
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Dubz
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weebaldy
16 Feb 2018, 08:03 PM
Gothamcelt
16 Feb 2018, 10:35 AM
Bill Leckie has a good piece on the game last night, until he has a wee dig at the GB.
Possibly couldn't help himself but then again I'm sure he will report what he hears when rangers play at the weekend.

LOUD AND PROUD Celtic’s win against Zenit St Petersburg was one of the finest European nights at Parkhead says Bill Leckie
The margins between them going over to Russia 1-0 up or 4-0 up were as thin as the sole on a modern-day boot
Spoiler: click to toggle
Was at the game and I for one never heard the up the Ra at the start of the game. I maybe wrong but did anyone else hear it prior to kick off or is it just that carrots selective hearing? :thumbsup:
The whole stadium sang it ffs. :lol:
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Wailer
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justinjest
16 Feb 2018, 07:53 PM
The record has been anti Celtic for as long as I can remember - just off the top of my head, the hearse sent to CP when it looked like we might go under, the Thugs, thieves headline, the time they put a 4 page spread on the 10th? anniversary of rangers battle with leeds on the day we had a big CL night and the new team were still languishing in the championship (I wonder what sector of the population they were aiming for?), negativity in our transfers / positivity in theirs - much as I don't want to see anyone losing their jobs, I won't miss the record or its biased reporting - or the sunday post and its sectarian employment policy (no papes need apply).
The hearse was the sister paper, Sunday mail
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WolfieBhoy
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pedrok
15 Feb 2018, 01:48 PM
Pat_Mustard
15 Feb 2018, 01:16 PM
asterisk_years
15 Feb 2018, 11:34 AM
It's still amazing to me that Hearts never got a stand closed for physically assaulting an opposition manager.
Never found guilty in a court of law :nono:
He was found guilty on one charge, Not Proven on another.

The Crown Office arsed that one up, not the jury.
No they didn't.

The argument put forward was that because the PF added the "aggravated by religious prejudice" to the charges, when this wasn't proved then he couldn't be convicted of the charge. If they had just charged assault then he would have been convicted.

This just isn't the case. The PF charged him with breach of the peace and assault, both of which were "aggravated by religious prejudice". The jury found him guilty of breach of the peace, striking the religious prejudice part. This shows that they were very much aware that they could remove the religious prejudice part and find him guilty of assault if they were not convinced the religious prejudice part was proved.

There's no getting away from the fact that the jury did not consider what we all saw clearly as an assault to be an assault. The only way you can blame the PF for this is if they didn't include the TV footage as evidence.
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Gothamcelt
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weebaldy
16 Feb 2018, 08:03 PM
Gothamcelt
16 Feb 2018, 10:35 AM
Bill Leckie has a good piece on the game last night, until he has a wee dig at the GB.
Possibly couldn't help himself but then again I'm sure he will report what he hears when rangers play at the weekend.

LOUD AND PROUD Celtic’s win against Zenit St Petersburg was one of the finest European nights at Parkhead says Bill Leckie
The margins between them going over to Russia 1-0 up or 4-0 up were as thin as the sole on a modern-day boot
Spoiler: click to toggle
Was at the game and I for one never heard the up the Ra at the start of the game. I maybe wrong but did anyone else hear it prior to kick off or is it just that carrots selective hearing? :thumbsup:
I sit above (to the left) of the GB ) and I heard it.

With the adrenaline flowing, Walk On just finished, they belted that out a few (myself included) sang it.

On behalf of myse l f and CFC I apologise.
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jbj712
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The Record, like most the press in Scotland has had a long history of anti-Celtic, anti-catholic, anti-Irish bigotry, ranging from employment practices to deliberate attempts to undermine our club.
Minty’s grubby fingerprints were all over much of the latter.
That guy should be the subject of a judicial inquiry given the damage he has done to several sectors of Scottish economic and social life.
Anyone losing their job is not a thing to rejoice in but in deciding to take the King’s shilling, guys like Keevins forfeit a lot of sympathy!
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Dubz
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Gothamcelt
16 Feb 2018, 08:24 PM
weebaldy
16 Feb 2018, 08:03 PM
Gothamcelt
16 Feb 2018, 10:35 AM
Bill Leckie has a good piece on the game last night, until he has a wee dig at the GB.
Possibly couldn't help himself but then again I'm sure he will report what he hears when rangers play at the weekend.

LOUD AND PROUD Celtic’s win against Zenit St Petersburg was one of the finest European nights at Parkhead says Bill Leckie
The margins between them going over to Russia 1-0 up or 4-0 up were as thin as the sole on a modern-day boot
Spoiler: click to toggle
Was at the game and I for one never heard the up the Ra at the start of the game. I maybe wrong but did anyone else hear it prior to kick off or is it just that carrots selective hearing? :thumbsup:
I sit above (to the left) of the GB ) and I heard it.

With the adrenaline flowing, Walk On just finished, they belted that out a few (myself included) sang it.

On behalf of myse l f and CFC I apologise.
Wasn’t the GB who started it, came from the Celtic end.
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