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Celtic By Numbers Thread; *** NEW 23rd June - Life in the Danger Zone ***
Topic Started: 29 Aug 2017, 07:01 PM (20,105 Views)
Celtic By Numbers
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http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/finding-light-dark-places/

Tierney, Sinclair, Ralston. It wasn't all bad v PSG. There were some candles in the wind.
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Celtic By Numbers
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Introducing a new measure for overall attacking threat. HH
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Celtic By Numbers
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http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/boa-constrictor-cobra/

Controlled, efficient, ruthless. More evidence against Dundee that Rodgers's vision is taking shape.
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15not25
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Lovely stuff, fascinating
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Celtic By Numbers
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http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/derby-delight-for-dominant-celtic/

Rarely hitting the heights, Celtic nevertheless extended their unbeaten domestic run to 57. A couple of scares apart, Celtic enjoyed Derby day. A look at team performances.
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Celtic By Numbers
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http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/boyata-and-simunovic-reunited-derby-defensive-analysis/

Why Brown was not Bhoy of the Match. Plus Simunovic, Armstrong and Griffiths. Yes. Griffiths.
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Benjamin7
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These posts are fascinating to read, offers a nice perspective on games. Thanks :)
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ballbhoy
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Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 07:05 AM
http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/boyata-and-simunovic-reunited-derby-defensive-analysis/

Why Brown was not Bhoy of the Match. Plus Simunovic, Armstrong and Griffiths. Yes. Griffiths.
I think your conclusion that "I hope this shows why the Brown for Man of the Match calls are wide of the mark" shows why its dangerous to base your judgement on stats alone.
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Joe the Baker
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ballbhoy
26 Sep 2017, 07:29 AM
Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 07:05 AM
http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/boyata-and-simunovic-reunited-derby-defensive-analysis/

Why Brown was not Bhoy of the Match. Plus Simunovic, Armstrong and Griffiths. Yes. Griffiths.
I think your conclusion that "I hope this shows why the Brown for Man of the Match calls are wide of the mark" shows why its dangerous to base your judgement on stats alone.
Brown was Motm by a country mile on Saturday.
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Celtic By Numbers
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ballbhoy
26 Sep 2017, 07:29 AM
Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 07:05 AM
http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/boyata-and-simunovic-reunited-derby-defensive-analysis/

Why Brown was not Bhoy of the Match. Plus Simunovic, Armstrong and Griffiths. Yes. Griffiths.
I think your conclusion that "I hope this shows why the Brown for Man of the Match calls are wide of the mark" shows why its dangerous to base your judgement on stats alone.
It maybe didn't come across well in the post but I absolutely do not do that. I trust what I see with my own eyes and the subjective element is always there. Equally I observe that some folk pick 1 or 2 moments out of 90 minutes activity and base their whole view on that performance on those 1 or 2 seconds.

But please be assured I do not take the approach of generating an opinion of the stats alone as context is key. Bear in mind I record every player action so the numbers are a good starting point!
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Joe the Baker
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Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 09:42 AM
Equally I observe that some folk pick 1 or 2 moments out of 90 minutes activity and base their whole view on that performance on those 1 or 2 seconds.

Who does that mate ?
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ballbhoy
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Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 09:42 AM
ballbhoy
26 Sep 2017, 07:29 AM
Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 07:05 AM
http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/boyata-and-simunovic-reunited-derby-defensive-analysis/

Why Brown was not Bhoy of the Match. Plus Simunovic, Armstrong and Griffiths. Yes. Griffiths.
I think your conclusion that "I hope this shows why the Brown for Man of the Match calls are wide of the mark" shows why its dangerous to base your judgement on stats alone.
It maybe didn't come across well in the post but I absolutely do not do that. I trust what I see with my own eyes and the subjective element is always there. Equally I observe that some folk pick 1 or 2 moments out of 90 minutes activity and base their whole view on that performance on those 1 or 2 seconds.

But please be assured I do not take the approach of generating an opinion of the stats alone as context is key. Bear in mind I record every player action so the numbers are a good starting point!
Fair enough mate but Brown was MoTM by a country mile on Saturday - to say it is "wide of the mark" doesn't wash. This wasn't based on 1 or 2 moments either. BBC did a nice wee montage on Sunday evening showing how effective he was.
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stevie21
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Joe the Baker
26 Sep 2017, 09:43 AM
Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 09:42 AM
Equally I observe that some folk pick 1 or 2 moments out of 90 minutes activity and base their whole view on that performance on those 1 or 2 seconds.

Who does that mate ?
I think loads of folk do - if someone has an average game and scores a goal, they sometimes get elevated into the top 3 in MOTM posts. Which is fine if you're totally stuck for a 3rd person to put in
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Joe the Baker
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stevie21
26 Sep 2017, 11:29 AM
Joe the Baker
26 Sep 2017, 09:43 AM
Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 09:42 AM
Equally I observe that some folk pick 1 or 2 moments out of 90 minutes activity and base their whole view on that performance on those 1 or 2 seconds.

Who does that mate ?
I think loads of folk do - if someone has an average game and scores a goal, they sometimes get elevated into the top 3 in MOTM posts. Which is fine if you're totally stuck for a 3rd person to put in
I don't believe anyone bases their opinion of a player based on 1 or 2 seconds out of 90 minutes.

Without bogging this thread down too much, it's why I'm not a huge fan of stats. They can tell you loads of things that aren't really true. The stats and numbers tell us Brown wasn't MOTM on Saturday.
Anyone who watched the game is able to tell you otherwise.
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Celtic By Numbers
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ballbhoy
26 Sep 2017, 07:29 AM
Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 07:05 AM
http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/boyata-and-simunovic-reunited-derby-defensive-analysis/

Why Brown was not Bhoy of the Match. Plus Simunovic, Armstrong and Griffiths. Yes. Griffiths.
I think your conclusion that "I hope this shows why the Brown for Man of the Match calls are wide of the mark" shows why its dangerous to base your judgement on stats alone.
Agree. Which is why I don't.
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Joe the Baker
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It feels like yesterday... I wish it was tomorrow.
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Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 12:04 PM
ballbhoy
26 Sep 2017, 07:29 AM
Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 07:05 AM
http://celticbynumberscom.ipage.com/boyata-and-simunovic-reunited-derby-defensive-analysis/

Why Brown was not Bhoy of the Match. Plus Simunovic, Armstrong and Griffiths. Yes. Griffiths.
I think your conclusion that "I hope this shows why the Brown for Man of the Match calls are wide of the mark" shows why its dangerous to base your judgement on stats alone.
Agree. Which is why I don't.
So, this begs the question then.

Why was Brown not MOTM on Saturday ?
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Celtic By Numbers
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Joe the Baker
26 Sep 2017, 12:02 PM
stevie21
26 Sep 2017, 11:29 AM
Joe the Baker
26 Sep 2017, 09:43 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I think loads of folk do - if someone has an average game and scores a goal, they sometimes get elevated into the top 3 in MOTM posts. Which is fine if you're totally stuck for a 3rd person to put in
I don't believe anyone bases their opinion of a player based on 1 or 2 seconds out of 90 minutes.

Without bogging this thread down too much, it's why I'm not a huge fan of stats. They can tell you loads of things that aren't really true. The stats and numbers tell us Brown wasn't MOTM on Saturday.
Anyone who watched the game is able to tell you otherwise.
Another way to look at it is that I believe Brown played well but others played better. Blog showing attacking performance will be up later. Read both and see if you have a change of opinion. End of the day it's an opinion.
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Joe the Baker
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Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 12:07 PM
Joe the Baker
26 Sep 2017, 12:02 PM
stevie21
26 Sep 2017, 11:29 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I don't believe anyone bases their opinion of a player based on 1 or 2 seconds out of 90 minutes.

Without bogging this thread down too much, it's why I'm not a huge fan of stats. They can tell you loads of things that aren't really true. The stats and numbers tell us Brown wasn't MOTM on Saturday.
Anyone who watched the game is able to tell you otherwise.
Another way to look at it is that I believe Brown played well but others played better. Blog showing attacking performance will be up later. Read both and see if you have a change of opinion. End of the day it's an opinion.
:thumbsup:

You put a lot of effort into your stuff mate. I don't really agree with some of your conclusions but that's fine, as you say opinions.

I don't think it's possible that any blog will change my mind on how Brown played on Saturday though.
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stevie21
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Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 12:07 PM
Joe the Baker
26 Sep 2017, 12:02 PM
stevie21
26 Sep 2017, 11:29 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I don't believe anyone bases their opinion of a player based on 1 or 2 seconds out of 90 minutes.

Without bogging this thread down too much, it's why I'm not a huge fan of stats. They can tell you loads of things that aren't really true. The stats and numbers tell us Brown wasn't MOTM on Saturday.
Anyone who watched the game is able to tell you otherwise.
Another way to look at it is that I believe Brown played well but others played better. Blog showing attacking performance will be up later. Read both and see if you have a change of opinion. End of the day it's an opinion.
I've no problem with stats at all, and I think you use them interestingly. Your point however seemed to be that because Brown didn't have the best defensive performance compared to Jozo etc. that he didn't warrant MOTM which is flawed logic with or without stats. I might have been reading you wrong but that's what I took from that first article.

The amount of people who think stats are heretical though :lol:
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Celtic By Numbers
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stevie21
26 Sep 2017, 02:25 PM
Celtic By Numbers
26 Sep 2017, 12:07 PM
Joe the Baker
26 Sep 2017, 12:02 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Another way to look at it is that I believe Brown played well but others played better. Blog showing attacking performance will be up later. Read both and see if you have a change of opinion. End of the day it's an opinion.
I've no problem with stats at all, and I think you use them interestingly. Your point however seemed to be that because Brown didn't have the best defensive performance compared to Jozo etc. that he didn't warrant MOTM which is flawed logic with or without stats. I might have been reading you wrong but that's what I took from that first article.

The amount of people who think stats are heretical though :lol:
Comparing players doing different jobs is apples and pears and is obviously a judgement call. MoM is supposed to be fun not an exercise in falling out, however! 😀
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